Kate O’Brien Joins Us On The Steve Jobs based Join Up Dots Free Podcast Interview
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Introducing Kate O’Brien
Kate O’Brien is our guest today, on the Steve Jobs inspired Join Up Dots free podcast interview.
She is a lady with an inspiring story of hardship, pain and an emergence as one of the best thought leaders in the world today
After coming through tremendous challenges (including drug addiction, anorexia & depression), she became a recognized national leader in her field as a registered nurse, speaking at international health conferences, being nominated for a special regional health award for her national work in training doctors & nurses throughout New Zealand as powerful change agents & was a finalist for the New Zealand Emerging Speaker of the Year in 2013.
She received high accolades for her work as a national project manager with her work being featured at national conferences.
Which is all very powerful stuff, but doesn’t excite me as much as the moment in her life when she felt she was on the wrong path.
How The Dots Joined Up For Kate
The ladder she had been climbing was on the wrong wall, as despite a thriving career, she then let it all go to pursue her life calling of empowering billions globally to wake up and deeply own their power.
She founded GameChangerLive, her 2-day highly acclaimed transformational workshop which is run through Australasia & South East Asia, and her three month advanced breakthrough program, GameChanger High Performance.
And now it seems that she can’t stop pushing the bubble of comfort that she found herself in, in fact we all find ourselves, to take bolder and bigger actions.
So does it all come down to the simple moment of responsibility?
We realise that we are the only ones that are responsible for our own lives, so have to take the action?
Or is there much more to making a life exciting and empowering?
Well let’s find out as we bring onto the show to start joining up dots with the one and only Kate O’Brien
During the show we discussed such weighty topics with Kate O’Brien such as:
Why she was willing to post naked photos on her website and why social media is such a world of fake news nowadays
Kate shares how she came to the realisation of what she wanted to do in life, and the steps she took to make it happen (even having her husband pound the streets in a suit and tie)
How Kate can see that her early healthy issues have become such a huge positive in her life and actually showed her the way to where she is today.
Why it makes so much sense to share risk around in your life. Yeah make things happen, but dont burn every bridge that you have to make them happen.
How To Connect With Kate O’Brien
You can also check our extensive podcast archive by clicking here – enjoy
Full Transcription Of The Kate O’Brien Interview
When we’re young, we have an amazing positive outlook about how great life is going to be. But somewhere along the line we forget to dream and end up settling. Join Up Dots features amazing people who refuse to give up and chose to go after their dreams. This is your blueprint for greatness. So here’s your host live from the back of his garden in the UK. David Ralph.
David Ralph [0:34]
Yes, hello there. Good morning. My listeners in Join Up Dots land bases, your host David Ralph coming to you with another episode of the motivational powerhouse which is Join Up Dots slightly on edge at the moment because Skype did its thing but he Skype has been working perfectly Cool. All right. today. The guest couldn’t hear me I can hear the guest but we’ve now connected magic has been made and we’re going to create magic on today’s show because today’s guest is a lady with an inspiring story of how Pain and an emergency is one of the best thought leaders in the world today. After coming through tremendous challenges, including drug addiction, anorexia and depression, she became a recognised national leader in our field as a registered nurse speaking at international health conferences, being nominated for a special Regional Health award for national work and training doctors and nurses throughout New Zealand as powerful change agents, and was a finalist for the New Zealand emerging speaker of the Year in 2013. Now she received many accolades for her work as a national project manager with her work being featured at national conferences everywhere, which is all very powerful stuff, but doesn’t really excite me as much as the moment in her life when she felt she was on the wrong path. The ladder she’d been climbing was on the wrong wall as despite a thriving career she’d been let it all go to pursue her life calling on empowering billions globally to wake up and deeply own their power. She founded Game Changer live her two day highly acclaimed transformational workshop, which is run through Australasia and South East Asia and her three months boms breakthrough programme Game Changer high performance. And now it seems that she can’t stop pushing the bubble of comfort that she’s found herself in. In fact, we all find ourselves in to take bolder and bigger actions. So does it all come down to the simple moment of responsibility we realised that we were the only ones that are responsible for our own lives. So how to take action? Or is there much more to making a life exciting and empowering? Well, let’s find out as we bring them to the show to start joining up dots with the one and only Kate O’Brien. Good morning, Kate. How are you?
Kate O’Brien [2:33]
Hey, David, thanks so much for having me here.
David Ralph [2:36]
It is lovely to have you here. But well, let’s be honest, we’re not here. Where are we? You’re somewhere I could reach out my hand. I’m never going to touch okay. I’m never going to touch you. So whereabouts are you sitting at moment?
Kate O’Brien [2:46]
I’m sitting in Bali looking out my window at coconut trees.
David Ralph [2:51]
That’s not a bad place to be is it was this part of your vision? When you were sitting as a sole registered nurse and stuff did you think about coconut trees as the way people But
Kate O’Brien [3:01]
Not at all. Not at all. To be honest, I’ve been sort of just following this joining the dots as I go along, so to speak.
David Ralph [3:08]
Now you are now officially and I will share this with you and I’ll share the listeners as well. You are my absolute favourite guest. No one will ever come near you. Okay, because you have now become my screensaver. I like to do a bit of stalking. I like to do a bit of virtual stalking. And you’re the first guest ever, but when I’ve been over to this site, there’s naked photos, but there was no I was shocked. I was shocked rigid, and it took me 15 minutes to learn how to save them and get them on my desktop. So Bear Bear every morning. Is this about you being bold and bright. And what was that about? Because I’ve never had one guest that has shown me naked photos of themselves.
Kate O’Brien [3:47]
The question is did you screenshot the ones that were showing cellulite because they’re pretty much the ones that I’m showing. I’ve been
David Ralph [3:53]
married to the same woman for 30 years, it all becomes the same to me. Okay.
Kate O’Brien [3:58]
It does, doesn’t it? I’m sorry. What was that about? So they you know, the body is really perfect metaphor to talk about you know what we are able to strip back what we are not comfortable with what we can’t be worth within ourselves. So yeah, on the surface level, I’m absolutely talking about the body and I’m talking about getting naked and I’m literally getting naked and videos, etc. And I’m talking about being okay and choosing your body and not buying into the stereotypes and the pressures that’s out there around body. But really, I’m also talking about a whole lot more than that, because I’m not really that turned on by about the whole message around the body. It’s about more it’s about what are we hiding within ourselves? What can’t we be worth within ourselves, you know, so much on social media, this the images of, hey, look how amazing my marriages, and then yet this just, it’s just marriage behind the scenes. And it doesn’t mean it’s bad or it’s worse than what it’s been shown. It’s just marriage. It’s all of the shades of marriage. But what’s shown on social media is just one shade. We show the yellow shade, but we’re not showing the red shade, the green shade, the blue shade. We’re okay with the yellow shades in our life, but we’re not okay with the other shades. It’s like I can be happy, but I can’t be angry.
David Ralph [5:15]
I agree with it. I agree with this totally. And if you’ve listened to sort of any of the episodes of Join Up Dots recently, I’m on a big anti social media burst really, because there is a highlights, isn’t it? There is that highlights and it started to get me down because when I was doing Join Up Dots in the early days, fortunately, it went really well. But I spent a lot of time looking at what other people were doing. So didn’t sort of embrace the fact that I was doing very well for myself. I was thinking, Oh my God, why am I not speaking in front of 60,000 people? Why am I not doing this? Why am I not supporting Bruce Springsteen with my podcast, it just seemed to be that no matter where I was, there was somebody 17 steps ahead, but then you hear that kind of true story behind those 17 steps and the kids are running around. like a lunatic and the wife’s left them, and I’ve got a drink problem. It’s just fake, isn’t it? It’s as Trump says, Donald Trump, it’s fake news, Kate.
Kate O’Brien [6:09]
Absolutely. In fact, I was just we run a my husband and I, who we work together, we have the space, a space, we’ve got a couple hundred people on that. And really, the primary intention of that space is for people to have permission disrupt themselves, so to be seen, to share more of themselves so that they can build that as a muscle to use in their world. And the, for example, just before I got on the podcast with you, a woman in that space, shared two pictures of her the one that’s on social media, and then she actually took an actual picture of herself and she collage them together. They look like two different people, two different people. And the whole time we thought that she was this one woman, she looks 100% different. And she said, Look, this here is what I’m terrified of the world to see. I don’t go out of my house, I hide behind social media. I’m terrified of people seeing me. Now that is just that’s what’s going All in all in the world, we’re terrified of being seen. And so you know, the naked stuff as a metaphor.
David Ralph [7:07]
So did you always be bold and bright and breezy and put your best foot forward? Or did you? Can you understand what that woman’s going through? Were you that person at one stage?
Kate O’Brien [7:17]
I can understand that so intimately. It is not funny. I had social anxiety I remember. So I’m standing at the supermarket with a packet of I think cigarettes in my hand. I’m maybe 20 years old, and I’m standing there looking at the checkout and I’m the third person on the line and I’m, I’m shitting my pants, sweating bullets thinking there. And in like, a minute and a half. I’m gonna have to speak to another human being. And I think he’s sick.
David Ralph [7:47]
Is Strange, though, isn’t it? Because you’re here, you’re on this podcast. You’re very forceful. As I say, going over to that website. It’s now you’ve taken over from Katy Perry for me, you have taken over conflict, and it’s the There’s a panco image, there’s a warrior image. It’s all very bold. But we’re like that, aren’t we? I hate going into parties. I detest going into parties. If I don’t know anyone, where I actually had to switch into kind of podcast mode or professional speaker mode. Get me in front of a room of 2000 people, I can do that with the eyes closed, but go into a room of maybe 1015 people. I hate it. So it’s funny how we’ve got all these these levels, and nobody’s going to be the fully realised piece. Oh,
Kate O’Brien [8:32]
absolutely. It’s as the roles as the roles that we’re playing.
David Ralph [8:36]
So when you were on the wrong ladder, let’s let’s get back to that bit because that is fascinating for me, you are rocking and rolling. And obviously we’re going to talk more about what you’re doing at the moment. But when you got to that point, and you decided to throw your career In, so many people who listen to this show, are at that point, that’s the scary point. And that’s the point when people are going oh yeah, you’re going mental. You’ve created this. This is brilliant. This Is what you wanted in life? Did you sort of look around at people and say, Look, this is what I’m going to do? Or did you keep the dreams secret yourself? Because that is a key point where people can stop you before you even get going.
Kate O’Brien [9:12]
Yeah, well, great question. I think I want to take you back a little bit. There was a quarter of my time, obviously, and you just touched on it briefly in the introduction. I went through the anorexia and then Believe me on the drug addiction. So it took a lot to get through that to then get my life to this place where I had the National Career and things were going along so well and and to be honest, a lot of that did fulfil parts of me. So it wasn’t like it was a bad like it was it wasn’t I wasn’t even tolerating but I was tolerating good, and I think sometimes it was the one of the biggest risks of getting to like living really an aligned life or like an extraordinary life is this good life that can kind of get in the way. So I was living the good luck, we’re I’ve ticked all the boxes. And I remember because I had gone through So much in the earlier years, that on the side, so when I wasn’t working on the side, I was helping people on the side, my husband and I were, we were just just coaching people for free in our house and we were running little sessions and seminars for free in our house. And that was like a hobby and how we contributed and gave back. And it got to the point where we’re thinking, Isn’t it crazy that we’re going to work to earn an income and to support our side hobby of helping people. And I remember sitting there and feeling like even though all of the boxes are ticked, and this is very safe, and there are a number of parts of me that are super fulfilled, and us you know, accolades National Credit was amazing. I just I really knew that if I looked myself in the eye when I was an 18 year old, gorgeous all wrinkly nannies and my rocking rocking chair.
David Ralph [10:51]
On Kate, will you please do not put that photo on?
Kate O’Brien [10:54]
David, it’s coming your way. Give me your address. I knew for a fact that there would be some legal abuse. Great for me. And I have nursed when I was a registered nurse enough people who died when I held their hands looked into their eyes as their eyes weren’t fixed to know that there was not something that I wanted on my own soul at the end. And so, the day that I left, actually was the day that I was offered a manager’s role. And so it was the next level and you know, to be honest, to be a nursing manager at a hospital when I was at the point that I was in, there was such the dream offer and then to say, actually, wow, no. And here’s my resignation was scary and liberating.
David Ralph [11:42]
scary. Writing is fascinating base because I get more emails from people now. I must have got 30 in the last month where people have been saying to me, I have turned it down promotions because it means that I’m tied to this job. They’re, they’re working in jobs. They’re doing well. They’re getting To that point, but companies are saying, look, we recognise your achievements. Let’s give you a promotion. And again, who actually, this isn’t what I want to do, but they can’t work out what they do want to do. So is it a good idea to have a kind of side hustle hobby going in the background? You was running these little workshops helping you or your husband? Was that a good indication of if you’re willing to do it for free? That might be a business to move forward into?
Kate O’Brien [12:27]
Yeah, absolutely. Look, I think you have to, you have to spread your risk. And I’m, and this is coming from a person I take it I take big risks, and I take a lot of risk. And I love risk. And I think there’s an element to which being willing to risk and not stay inside the comfort bubble is a really important thing for growth and innovation. Also, the actual the most innovative people in the world have actually spread their risk. And what I mean by that is, for example, if we if you if you’re investing right sound effects advice is often to spread your risk over a number of buckets. So you might have one bucket that’s that there’s a sort of a safe bucket, long term sort of low, you know, low risk, but low returns. And then you’ve got another bucket that’s high risk, high returns high potential returns, I would say kind of like this. It’s like, if you’re really risking it in one area, like you’re checking yourself out there, you have to have an element of safety and groundedness and other areas so that you can fully go into that part that you’re risking. Does that make sense?
David Ralph [13:31]
It makes you carry on
Kate O’Brien [13:33]
Yeah, yeah, in fact, and when you look at the the innovators that have been out there, they look extremely risky, but they’ve created stability in other areas. I saw for example, a couple of years recently, they were said you know, with all the stuff out there go all and burn the bridges, you know, burn the fucking boats so that you don’t go back to the previous Island. And so what they did is they both left their jobs to go coaching. However, there is a nation’s in it In Dida, here we are with our clients. And now the over the couple of months is the small amount of savings went down and the clients weren’t coming in because let’s face it, there is a lot to learn in any business coaching business it looks extremely easy from the outside here is a lot to learn there’s a lot of foundations to be laid there was just a lot whether it’s any business and they became so stressed and doing that, that the energy that was going into what they what they were doing was very stressed very grabby, very, like a terrified kind of energy because they were not sure how they’re about to pay the mortgage. The best advice we gave them was actually get a job, get a job. Do this as a side hustle and have freedom in your side hustle so that you’re spreading your risk. And they did that they both got a job and then guess what? There is this this level of innovation vacation and freedom and there’s a different energy in what they’re doing now. And they’re starting to get clients and
David Ralph [15:07]
I think this is perfect
Kate O’Brien [15:09]
spray, spray risk,
David Ralph [15:11]
this old phrase about jumping off a cliff and making it up as you go down. You know, I just think it’s rubbish. And if you’ve listened to any of the episodes, listeners of Join Up Dots, you will hear me say the same thing all the time. And we call it this slide of faith instead of the leap of faith, where you just kind of transition gradually. Now I was a really financially successful corporate trainer for years and years and years and years. And when I decided to quit to do this, I knew there was going to be a shortfall in cash. So I made that shortfall as small as possible by over a period of time building passive income streams in and it was only paying things like my my TV each month or one of my food bills. You know, it was a neat little things, but he sort of added up. And then when I was at Join Up Dots, for a period of time in the evening, I had a side job where I was actually Picking up people’s Indian takeaways and driving them around their house. Now a lot of people said to me, oh, why are you doing that? What? Why are you doing that? You know, you, you had a good job. And now you’re doing that you’re picking up takeaway. And I said to him, I don’t care. I don’t care, because base is making it easier for me. And while I was doing that case all the time, as a family, we were looking at our expenses and reducing the expenses until we got to a point where actually Join Up Dots This show was covering it. And then that was when risky times could occur, but at the beginning, it was just get I got what I’ve got, and make it as easy as possible for me and the family without getting stressed and het up and stuff. But people go help, whatever. I don’t agree with it.
Kate O’Brien [16:45]
Yeah, it’s I think it’s smart, strategic risk. And, you know, what you’ve just described is clearly that which is why you can be in this for the long haul. And I think a lot of people really short term short term and they’re thinking short term in the short term, and they’re also their ability to weather
Because with anything you’ve got to get you have to have the NASA grip. You know, here’s my favourite words gret gumption gusto you have to have grit gumption and gusto when you’re willing to go to go after things because you just said you list a great corporate job. And then you were delivering dinner at nighttime. You know, I’ve always said I’ve lived in a caravan if I need to, and, and I will do whatever it takes, because there’s no other life. I want them this.
David Ralph [17:30]
We’re gonna play some words now motivational words, and then it’s gonna come straight back to what we’re talking about. But this isn’t very well, Jim Carrey.
Jim Carrey [17:38]
My father could have been a great comedian, but he didn’t believe that that was possible for him. And so he made a conservative choice. Instead, he got a safe job as an accountant. And when I was 12 years old, he was let go from that safe job. And our family had to do whatever we could to survive. I learned many great lessons from my father, not the least of which was that you can fail What you don’t want, so you might as well take a chance on doing what you love? Isn’t it
David Ralph [18:05]
amazing when we listen to those words, literally all of us go for the thing that we don’t want. I spent 10 years in a bank didn’t want to be a banker. Now, I can’t think of anything worse, but I did it. Yes, we can argue about all the experience that I gained there and buying insurance companies has led to where I am now. So it wasn’t wasted. I don’t think any part of our life is wasted. It’s all experience. But we never really sit down. Do we as that 15 year old, 16 year old 17 year old self and think to ourselves, I want to enjoy my life. It’s just, I want to have a car. I want to go on holidays. I want to it’s just all about money at that point. And my son is 15 now and I’m saying to him, when you get to that moment, let’s talk that’s all because I’m willing to support you if you’re willing to put the hassle in. I’m willing to support you because I want you to have the dream life.
Kate O’Brien [18:58]
Hmm, that’s awesome.
David Ralph [19:00]
So why do we not do it? Why do we Why did the young Kate not do that? Why did the young David not do that? Why did we not sit there? Was it just that we were programmed from previous generations? Was it that we didn’t have the opportunities? Or is it just in our heart? We can’t quite believe that we can have our cake and eat it.
Kate O’Brien [19:19]
I think I think we’re brought up thinking in boxes. You know, we’re thinking in boxes and terms of what we’re supposed to be who we are, who we’re supposed to be what we’re supposed to think what the world is like, what’s available to us. And you know, even the careers sort of counselling in New Zealand we call it careers counselling, which is for teenagers at high school. It’s like what do you want to do beyond high school and this sort of you create your career path. And the career counselling in itself is very linear. It’s very pre thought out boxed. It’s, well you can do teaching or you can become a lawyer or you know, you can it’s, you know, very I’d say stock standard, almost I paint like numbers and I really wonder how much we are. We’re really encouraging and giving permission to our children to actually carve their own path in thinking you and to trust what’s inside of them. So often we’re not saying, hey, trust what’s in you. In school, we’re saying this is the facts, now memorise it and then vomit it back out, regurgitate it at exam time, and we’ll mark you on how much you can vomit correctly. Yeah, you know, we’re not we’re not saying Think for yourself, be a thinker, be a thought leader. Look out into the world and identify problems that are that idea. And then be resourceful within yourself to go, hey, look, I’m the answer to what’s out there. And I don’t have to do it alone, but I’m proud of my resourcefulness is I can rally, I can enrol people. I can create resources. I can bring people in with resources and we can we can create answers together. And I think this is one of the things that we need to equip children with. So I think there’s a lot of stuff going on in fit my whole thinking around that 100% impacts how we raise, we’ve got two children. I’ve got a teenage daughter who’s almost 15. And we’ve got a son who’s nine. And you know, it’s interesting. We came to Bali to give them a different outlook. And they’re having a very different upbringing here, our nine year old Actually, we took them out of school, nine months ago, when just after he turned eight, and so he sorry to say three to nine, he won’t go back to school. But what we do is we’ve hired private teachers, so he has private teachers coming to the house. So he gets taught the curriculum, the core curriculum, and then we build and design his learning and his education around there, which is based around just a very expensive model, and it’s so different to see how he’s, he’s growing now and comparison. You know, nine months ago when he was at school, he was starting to get I would say, which was the instigator for Husband and I taking him out he was starting to get grumpy and a little bit aggressive a little bit he had in the background of his mind this I’m dumb story going on at the age of nine if we keep them in an environment that isn’t directly but like perpetuates this I’m dumb story because we are just saying, Hey, this is where you have to be. And if you’re not the shit, you’re not the mate, you know, you have to do everything to get to the standard that we set and prove it and the way that we say. So the he was grumpy. He was a little bit of aggressive. He was poor, but you know, I’m not good enough. Nine months later, this little dude is shining. He’s so shining. He just said to my husband and I about an hour ago. Hey, Mom and Dad Do you mind I’m just going to take myself down for lunch down the road and I’m going to get some grilled chicken and take myself for a swim. And I’m like, this is this. This little guy hit hit like zero confidence and he just asked for the money and he took himself to a restaurant at the age of nine and he’s just sitting there having lunch on his own. He’s got a story. phone to ring us. And we want to give him those faces, you know. So it’s almost like he’s on a different trajectory trajectory on his life than what he would have been if we had continued to be in that linear. Socially expected. conditioning for him is one
David Ralph [23:17]
of those big dots, isn’t it where we talk about big dots on the Join Up Dots timeline where literally, it could have been his worst time in his life. He could have been there going, No, I don’t want to go. my mates are at school. You know, I won’t know anyone in Bali. I won’t know this. I won’t know there. But of course, you know, at the age of nine, he didn’t have a choice. And so mom and dad sort of took him where they thought was best. But now they look back at that moment and go, Oh, my god, that was a.in my life that really changed everything. Now talking about the dots in your life. Obviously at the very beginning, you had some dark times you have some very dark times, we find a lot but when you get far enough away from the dark times, they actually become the good times. You can see them in a different way, but a bit black dots and white dots. This isn’t the same in your life. When you look back at your anorexia and your self help issues. Do you sort of think well thank God for that? Because that really did me on that different path.
Kate O’Brien [24:12]
100% Oh my gosh, I mean, even my dad, my dad growing up said was a really hard worker on one hand, and then on the other hand, he was an alcoholic, and he was really violent. And the funny thing is, you know, for years I didn’t have any relationship with dead now my experience the way my father occurs to me is I am so freakin grateful that I’ve got him as my dead and I tell him it on a regular basis and actually, as I say that I feel a few tears welling up Yeah, I just can I swear, David,
David Ralph [24:47]
you can you’ve already done it several times guy he’s
Kate O’Brien [24:51]
like yeah, I was so freakin I’m so freakin grateful. So here’s the thing.
If I hadn’t had a dead the head of perhaps given me What I wanted in terms of a father, I wouldn’t be the woman that I am now. I got the dad that I needed to have the experiences that had me dig really deep. Now here’s the here’s the whole paradox of this, you know, I spent so many years hating my dad, not having a relationship with him. When I actually got far enough away and you sit far enough away did make it a white dot rather than a black dot, I actually got to also see inside dad’s eyes and walk in dad’s shoes in my head and actually see how to dad’s life occur to him. And you know what I saw, I saw a man who loved his family so fiercely, that he worked so hard to provide for them that he had nothing left in the tank. Then his son died. And when his son died, his him and his wife just fell to pieces. And the only thing they were told is that I had to carry on for the rest of the kids. And so that’s what they did. And so he started drinking to bury the And he did his best and he didn’t know how to deal with it. And when I saw that I thought Chase, and here I have been hating him. We literally he never had the fear on my mom. He didn’t do it. Like he just dedicated his life and he had no coping skills and a tonne of grief. I tell you what, David, I have a very, very, very different relationship to him now. And guess what, you know, something funny, the moment not the moment, sorry, within nine months of my sister and myself both turning around how we saw him. So we used to relate to him as he was that asshole. That’s all the only way we related to him. Whether we spoke to him or not energetically, he felt it. When when we both got there and then we shifted around, we decided to relate to him as a leader. This is a guy who was still drinking alcohol he was still smashed most of the time he was still socially awkward. We related to him consistently as a leader and as the leader of the family, and after took nine months and then he heard it and He broke down and he went into a And literally, I’m talking like a miracle transformation. He went from being socially awkward, just difficult to be around to. He is a beautiful, gentle person. He’s done a lot of work on himself. He works on himself every day. He does his readings every day. And I gotta say, I got the dead now that he wanted. And I literally He’s my biggest supporter. He tells me all the time that he loves me and I literally, I can’t I can’t even get that wrong in his eyes. He’s been supportive of me.
David Ralph [27:34]
Well, I’ll be honest with you, okay. I love you for sharing that story as well on the show, because we all have baggage, don’t we? And I suppose it takes us back to what we were talking about at the very beginning about the sort of social media, you know, the fake news that you only see what people want you to see, you know, your dad isn’t effectively showing you reality. He was showing you real life. He wasn’t hiding. He wasn’t faking things up. It was just as life was But he’s far more powerful. I’ll tell you a story about myself. Okay? I realised strangely enough as I went through my career, everything went for me swimmingly. I just went into Job did really well went into leadership went into management went into business and my career just kept on going up and up and up. And then once I started Join Up Dots, I went at it like a rocket. I absolutely blew my heart and soul into it. 20 hours a day, really went for it big time. And as it went up, and up and up, I suddenly Well, I didn’t suddenly took me a long time to realise this. I suddenly realised I was scared of success. I was scared of success because it was the success that I was creating for myself. And I didn’t realise if I had the skills to to deal with that on my own because in in an employment in corporate job, you’ve always got some person ahead of you some management and some director and stuff, and you almost think to yourself, this isn’t my baby. But here I was creating a baby. That was actually becoming bigger than me and it indemnified. Me? Did you see that we’ve sort of people that you’re working with, but they, they want their transformation, they want it big time. But once it starts coming true for them, they start to think, Oh, hang on, hang on. This is this is real. This is too much for me to deal with.
Kate O’Brien [29:19]
Yeah, definitely. I think people say that they want things, but they don’t realise that they also have to, it’s not about the strategy. And it’s not just about the business. It’s actually growing though within us. I know that’s not even a word, but I like it to be to be able to match that level that you’re wanting. Otherwise it will come in and then it will go out. So we you know, we have we have to grow ourselves at the same time. I kind of think of it like a tree. So everyone picture in your mind a tree, you’ve got the roots below the surface, and then you’ve got the trunk in in the branches in the foliage. So everyone wants the big tree at the top, the branches and the foliage. But if they’re not sending down deeper roots ay ay ay ay ay growing and deepening within themselves, what they’ll do is they’ll develop this mess of big tree with these piddly little toothpick roads and everything will fall over. And you see this a lot with I mean, I’m not gonna name names, but this you know, some big people in the personal development industry and who have grown so fast, whether they’ve grown the structures within the business so fast, and they haven’t deepened the the underlying platform to make the move too far forward. They’ve grown the business so much they’ve grown, they’ve just got so much success, but the underlying structures haven’t been there even within themselves. And I’ve ended up falling over and had some really big crashes. So yeah, I’ve looked at this is really key.
David Ralph [30:43]
So if we seen that people, first of all, they don’t know what they want in life. Secondly, they don’t know how to go about it. And then once they decide what they want, they’re actually terrified but it’s coming true. It’s kind of easy to see why people Just like to go the easy route and stick themselves in a box and then moan about it with a few beers on Friday night.
Kate O’Brien [31:06]
Yeah, absolutely. You can see why that’s easy. The thing is, it’s like an itch, you’re kind of, you’re gonna scratch it temporarily. But this is this is an ongoing, actually, you’re going to have for 80 years unless you actually go in and deal with the root cause of what’s causing the achiness you’re going to be constantly scratching. And I see that, you know, people want to numb out to the pain of the temporary pain of not actually going and you know, basically doing what they want to do following their heart following their dreams, and tolerate and kind of sell themselves out a little bit so that they can feel safe. But kind of our time comes, you know, there’s a point in time where we have to face it. We did that. I think I said earlier, I used to nurse so many people when they’re on their deathbed. And all the time, David, they would just tell me about the regrets. They had. There was a same stories I thought that I’d get round to it one day I was waiting for this I was waiting for that and then what they realised that that was just actually the lie that they told themselves they were never intending on getting around to it
David Ralph [32:14]
is so depressing isn’t it? It really is depressing. But you know, you can understand it I as I wasted 25 years I say wasted I’m doing that little quoting thing with my fingers. Because I couldn’t I couldn’t do what I’m doing now without those 25 years I just know had yet to find its place. Now. Absolutely. Moving forward. Do I just you know, do I create this show and then best leads in different directions Do you do this show and this is what it is? Do you become you know, it’s it’s the unknown which is the most scary thing I think because everything is unknown is out of your comfort zone, isn’t it?
Kate O’Brien [32:52]
Look, here’s the thing, little doors open all the time and we have to step through the next door and I think that always little doors we often have Often we’re not making big decisions, they’re often little weak decisions, almost like if you can imagine, because a lot of people might say, I don’t even know what I’m here for. I don’t even know what lights me up. I just know that I don’t fully want this, right. So start to just follow the little things like maybe you get invited to a salsa class. And you’ve never done salsa before. And there’s like a little bit of a feeling of, oh, maybe I’ll do that. And then that’s like the little crack in the door. So say, Yes, go on to the salsa class, who knows who you might meet at the salsa class, either it might ignite something within you, that becomes a passion, who knows 10 years down, you know, by following those dots, you might end up opening up a salsa club and really enjoying your passion that way who knows you might meet someone and then they introduce you to someone else, that another passion gets opened up an opportunity. What is happening is we’re always getting these little cracks in the door and just follow where your heart goes. And but the thing is, I think sometimes we’re just gonna Kind of zoning out and we’re not doing that. And then the other thing I think we’re doing is we’re thinking that like these opportunities are going to be like have neon neon lights around them in tensile and big signs from God and arrows pointing versus this is your purpose. I think we’re just following it. We’re kind of unfolding it one doorway at a time.
David Ralph [34:23]
It makes total sense. Yeah, I had a guy that I was I don’t do a lot of one on one coaching anymore. I do more group stuff. But I had a guy and he said to me, you know, what, what do you think I should do? You know which book should I read? What? You know what self development course Should I sign up for? And I said to him, I tell you what, you should watch me the Yes man with Jim Carrey. Watch, first of all, and then you know, it’s enjoyable. It’s fun, but take the message of you can’t say no to something and see how you live change. Well, since he watched that, he has lost about 30 pounds. He’s met a new girlfriend. He went dumped her because she wasn’t good enough. Were at the beginning. He With a descriptor for the rest of his life, Ben, he went through another girl. They’re now married. They’ve now got two kids. They’re moving. It’s transformational. And all I said to him was once you stupid Jim Carrey film for an hour and a half, and it was just a switch, it was a switch that lit him up. And as you say, we’ve been in this it was all in him anyway, he kind of knew what he wanted and where to go. He just needed that one spot to move forward. And I think one of the problems Kate I don’t know about you is that people buy these courses and they buy these self development books and I buy this and I just keep on going around. So like looking for that key, but the key is women this, I like that word. I’m gonna I’m gonna nickname you.
Kate O’Brien [35:41]
Good. Neck it away. Absolutely. Look, I Ah, this is I mean, don’t get me started. I think I think the thing is a lot of even if you don’t mind me saying that the actual personal development industry, the fact that it’s now become an industry means that it becomes a space which people make money with. And therefore a lot of what people are seeing is the marketing around that the state is we all have within us what we need. And then this is awesome. And a lot of that is, you know, helps us remind of what’s back in there. And it’s great to be pointed back in the direction, there’s some awesome stuff to learn. But also, I think it’s important to not get attached to the tool or get attached to the strategy and realise that actually the the tool that that tool is actually yourself. And I think so many times people are getting attached to a strategy and it’s can I support it like this? For example, you know, I’ve got shoes on at the moment. I’ve got some walking shoes because I went for a walk and that was perfect for the walk. So perfect for that. But then, like David, you come along to me and you say, Kate, look, what are the big shoes and I say, here they are. These are perfect for a walk, right? And you’re like, but actually I don’t want to go for a walk. I actually want to go out dancing. So then you get some dancing shoes and that poopit for dancing, but then the next day you doing something else so it’s like we can’t even get attached to the shoes, which Don’t get attached to the strategy. But when you when you know within yourself that you can develop it resourcefulness, it’s like then you can flex and flow with all the different doors that are opening.
David Ralph [37:10]
I’ve got old man slippers on it a moment old man slippers and, and they are lovely. They’re lovely. They’re making love to my toes as we’re speaking. Just before we play the words of Steve Jobs that made the whole show possible. Game Changer live your two day highly acclaimed transformational workshop when you first launched but because this is one of the things I was talking to a guy who’s doing great stuff in the United Kingdom at the moment, and he’s businesses just flourishing. And he was saying the first conference he did. He sold 15 tickets and 12 people didn’t turn up and he couldn’t understand why people would buy tickets and just didn’t turn up. So he basically did it to an empty room. What was your first course like? Was it scary time the night before? Did you know it was going to fly? Did you think well, it’s just going to be a learning experience. We’re doing it and see what works and see what doesn’t
Kate O’Brien [38:00]
Gotcha. My husband and I, we were packing ourselves a night before. I don’t know, does that translate to wake us? With Peggy ago? Yeah, you know, and to fill that workshop, we didn’t have an audience, per se. And this was quite smart people say, Oh, I can’t do this, because I don’t have that whatever this and that is. So you know, people might say, I can’t create an event because I don’t have an audience. You know, these, I can’t do this, because I don’t have that become excuses. So we didn’t have an audience that we put on an event. And guess what we got, I think, about 240 people there for a couple that has no audience and they were there for a full day. So how did we do it? My husband dressed up in a certain time, he walked the streets every day for weeks on end, and talk to strangers and enrolled them and coming to our little workshop. We’ve got 200 Plus there, whatever it was, you know, just I think we get so stuck in these boxes. But in answer to your question here, we were terrified. We were so terrified. It was way more than What we thought coming in also, we were so significant about the whole thing, like it felt so significant. We didn’t have much practice. We were rigid as anything. We were trying to get perfect. We’re trying to be professional, so professional that we really weren’t ourselves. You know, we were shooting Thai people back then. So different show different to now. Yeah.
David Ralph [39:21]
But what I loved about that as well, is that your husband walked the streets. You know, nowadays it would be Oh, I don’t know enough about Facebook ads. I don’t know about Google, right? You just went old school and it still worked out?
Kate O’Brien [39:34]
Well, and that’s the thing. Yeah. And New Zealand. So we’re from New Zealand. We call it the number eight wire strategy. It’s like a New Zealand if something’s broken, you get out some number eight wire and you fix it yourself. So what makes me laugh is often in business, especially in online business. People say I can’t have it because I don’t have this. It’s like apply the number eight wash strategy. Just think like, if you would someone was to have gun to your head and say, You must do that thing. So if someone had a gun to our head and said, We must get over 200 people in the room within four weeks, you can bet your guts, we would have them in the room because we would think of 1000 ways to have it happen. Yeah, we would just do it, we would just do it. And I think people just don’t think like that. I think people are too precious and too much wanting the excuse. Because when we have the excuse, that means we don’t have to step up. And we don’t have to own our power. And I think it’s easier to feel comfortable rather than feel uncomfortable.
David Ralph [40:38]
I think that’s brilliant, brilliant advice. That’s a real good vision to have. It was not good vision because it’s basically terrorism. But but to have the gun at your head when you’ve got that decision to me. There was somebody that I used to speak to and he used to say, you know, if I said to you, there’s 100 grand in a carrier bag on the top of that roof of that building, would you try your best to get it literally everyone would go Well, yeah, would you know? But how would you get into the building? I don’t know. I’d run around. I try and find an open window. I tried it, you know, I’m working. I just get in. And it is yeah. So let’s get guns at our heads. No, not really people. But that’s a good idea to do. Now, we’re gonna play the words of Steve Jobs that really was the powerhouse that led to Join Up Dots. He said these words back in 2005. And as we always do, let’s listen to him again.
Steve Jobs [41:25]
Of course, it was impossible to connect the dots looking forward when I was in college. But it was very, very clear looking backwards. 10 years later. Again, you can’t connect the dots looking forward, you can only connect them looking backwards. So you have to trust that the dots will somehow connect in your future. You have to trust in something, your gut, destiny, life, karma, whatever. Because believing that the dots will connect down the road will give you the confidence to follow your heart, even when it leads you off the well worn path. And that will make all the difference
David Ralph [41:59]
huh? Did I make all the difference to you?
Kate O’Brien [42:02]
All the difference? Yeah, absolutely.
David Ralph [42:05]
When you look back on your life, Kate, as we asked most of our guests, is that a big dot? You know, you’ve already spoken about your dad, that sounded a big dog. You’ve spoken about your health issues. That was a big dog. But is there one moment conversation that you’ve been? Yeah, that really was when it became clear to me.
Kate O’Brien [42:23]
Yeah, I just think they’re all they were all big dots. They all felt like big dots. I’ll say one big I think there was a big.in terms of our marriage. When one particular day we recreated marriage based around 100% honesty and authenticity and integrity. And to be honest, even though we had said our wedding bells prior to that, it was the wedding vows that everyone says, and it was the operating how everyone typically operates where, you know, we do our best, but also we’re kind of operating on top of a pile of shit. So that’s really how we had been operating previous Previous to that, and then there’s this big dark moment where there was actually my husband and instigator that saying, look, we have stuff to clean up from our from our history together, and no longer willing to move forward on top of operating on top of that pile of crap. And it risked our marriage to go there and get honest and clean it up. And then I think what I really appreciated about that was that he risked, like, our marriage, but our marriage wasn’t actually the marriage that as as it was, wasn’t the marriage we actually wanted. So we had to let go of what we didn’t want even though it was comfortable in order to be able to have the possibility of what we could have. And so that was a really big.so
David Ralph [43:47]
I suppose taking us full circle joining up all the dots you you got naked again together, you really just became honest and threw away your clothes and became raw.
Kate O’Brien [43:57]
Mm hmm. Yeah, absolutely.
David Ralph [44:00]
I can get like nudity in this wherever we go. It’s my theme, I can bring it back to nakedness all the time, Kate
Kate O’Brien [44:09]
was that just because that we’ve got this new thing going on.
David Ralph [44:12]
I’ve always got a new thing going on. I really have a I’m only wearing me slippers at the moment. Everything else has been rips off during the show. Now, this is the part that we’ve been building up to. And this is the part that brings us to the end of the show. And we call it the Sermon on the mic when we send you back in time to have a one on one with your younger self. And if you could go back in time and speak to the young Kate, what age would you choose and what advice would you give? Well, we’re going to find out because I’m going to play the theme and when it fades you up. This is the Sermon on the mic
Unknown Speaker [44:51]
with the best
Kate O’Brien [45:06]
Darling, you’re 14 years old, and you are doing an amazing job of being a 14 year old. And I just want to let you know that it’s all going to work out, even in those times where you feel stressed, and you get scared. And you think you’re not good enough. You actually are. It’s gonna work out. You are good enough. It’s all gonna come together. Just have more fun. Be yourself, and don’t compromise on who you are. Thank you.
David Ralph [45:36]
Brilliant stuff. So Kate, what’s the number one best way that our audience would be listening today can connect with you?
Kate O’Brien [45:43]
Yes, social media. So Facebook, Instagram and YouTube and particularly if you do want to see me naked, then you can go and check me out on YouTube. Might be a little bit disappointing given that I don’t do full nudity, but there’s some pretty good stuff here. And so it’s YouTube at Kate Murray on Brian so Maria’s Ma, double e Kate Marie O’Brian. And you know I put out weekly, kind of provocative and the messages provocative videos Kate Marie O’Brien and it’s the same as Facebook and Instagram as well.
David Ralph [46:17]
We will have all the links on the show notes. Kate, thank you so much for spending time with us today. joining up those dots and please come back again when you have more dots to join up because I do believe that by joining up the dots and connecting our past is the best way to build our futures Katie O’Brien Thank you so much.
Kate O’Brien [46:33]
Thanks David so much for your time.
David Ralph [46:37]
Katie KO Brian lips in Bali started off in New Zealand. I like that image of big bold actions Gannett your head because you would, you would make the decisions. And I’m going to start using now I am going to start using that because there’s been a couple of things recently that I thought oh, I should be doing that and I’ll do it next week and next month and stuff and he just sort of moves on. So I’m gonna I’m gonna get that gun right in front of me. pinned up on the wall and have that pointing at my head all the time because you would make better decisions. And that is how lives change really is. Well, thank you so much for listening to this episode of Join Up Dots. And once again, we will be with you very shortly with another transformational episode. Cheers. See,
David doesn’t want you to become a faded version of the brilliant self you or wants to become. So he’s put together an amazing guide for you called the eight pieces of advice that every successful entrepreneur practices, including the two that changed his life. Head over to Join Up dots.com to download this amazing guide for free and we’ll see you tomorrow on Join Up Dots.