Welcome To the Join Up Dots Podcast with James Mulvany
Introducing James Mulvany
Todays guest joining us on the Join Up Dots podcast is a man on a mission.
To not only change the world of podcasting but also commercial radio.
Coming from the UK, this is one of those classic stories as you will hear when a passion matches a need and success occurs in rather quickly compared to mist.
He is the founder of Radio.co and Podcast.co, where he provides the infrastructure to broadcast your words to the world.
However, this is very different from what you would be getting from a show like Join Up Dots.
His software allows for multiple radio hosts scheduled around the world, going live at their regular times, building their own followings, just like you would get when you tune in your own radio and hear your favourite morning show.
All from the back of the garden, or your bedroom if that suits better.
How The Dots Joined Up For James
As he says “I was quite a geeky, introverted kid and definitely not the most outgoing kid in the world.
It was good for me going to university because that gave me a bit of a social life and got me out there in the real world.
That was really useful from a personal perspective but also from a business perspective as well.
There is only so much you can achieve, when you’re sat behind your computer.
I’ve never had a job, I started very young about 16 and was interested in radio and being a presenter.
I was also into making websites and was teaching myself that.
I decided not to pursue a career in radio but in the process of doing a bit of work experience in radio I learnt how to setup online radio and set up a stream to the internet.
At the time there were a few companies offering this service and it seemed like a way to make a few quid.
So in 2004 I set up a website called Wavestreaming. I didn’t really know what I was doing so I got the help of a guy in Australia who helped me set up the servers and stuff.
I went to university and had a nice income on the side, I think that first year we turned over about £18,000.
I did Interactive Multimedia at Uni and spent a lot of that time working on the business.
At this time we were still selling streaming services to radio stations.
I graduated Uni and hired some staff and managed to grow the business to the point where we got a very big deal with AOL, this was about 2011.
And the rest is history.
So it seems like a life with no worries and dark nights of the soul, but was this actually the case?
And where does he see the world of home broadcasting going in the future….more of the same, or something quite different?
Well lets find out as we bring onto the show to start joining up dots, with the one and only James Mulvany
During the show we discussed such weight subjects with James Mulvany such as:
James shared his first dream of getting £1,000 into his bank account and when he achieved it how good it felt.
We talk about the drawbacks of running a team and how it can frighten so many people from actually scaling their own business.
Why fundamentally being an entrepreneur is solving problems for as many people as possible.
Why its so important to make a difference to your customers by truly listening and talking to them as much as possible.
How To Connect With James Mulvany
Or of course you can check out thousands of podcast interviews in our archives here
Interview Transcription For James Mulvany Interview
David Ralph [0:01]
Once upon a time, there was a guy with a dream a dream, which is Jobs himself online and have a kick ass life working when he wanted him where he wanted across the world. Little did he know that dream would lead him into a world of struggle, burnout and debt. Until he found the magic ingredient and knows drunk was became a thing of the past, of course, was bad person. And now My dream is to make things happen. BU Welcome to Join Up Dots.
When we’re young, we have an amazing positive outlook about how great life is going to be. But somewhere along the line we forget to dream and end up settling. Join Up Dots features amazing people who refuse to give up and chose to go after their dreams. This is your blueprint for greatness. So here’s your host live from the back of his garden in the UK. David Ralph.
Unknown Speaker [0:55]
David Ralph [0:56]
Good morning. Good morning to you and welcome to Join Up Dots. Thank you for giving You’re is giving me a buddies and everything in between. Now today’s guest joining us on the Join Up Dots podcast is a man on a mission to not only change the world of podcasting but also commercial radio. Coming from the UK This is one of those classic storeys that you hear when a passion matches a need and success, I suppose occurs in rather quickly come compared to most out there. He’s the founder of radio CO and podcast CO, where he provides the infrastructure to broadcast his words to the world and for everybody out there. Now it’s very different from what you will be getting from a show like Join Up Dots he software allows for multiple radio hosts or podcast is scheduled around the world going live at their regular times building their own followings, just like you would get when you tune into your own radio and hear your favourite Morning Show, all from the back of the garden or your bedroom about suits better. Now, as he says I was quite a geeky introverted kid, and definitely not the most outgoing kid in the world. It was good for me going to university Because that gave me a bit of a social life and got me out there in the real world was really useful from a personal perspective, but also from a business one as well. There’s only so much you can achieve when you’re sat behind your computer CKUKV listeners, I’ve never had a job. I started very young about 16 and was interested in radio and being a presenter, I was also into making websites and was teaching myself fat. I decided not to pursue a career in radio. But in the process of doing a bit of work experience in radio, I learned how to set up online radio and set up a stream to the internet. And at a time, there were a few companies offering this service and it seemed like a way to make a few quid Now roll on 2004 I set up a website called wage streaming. I didn’t really know what I was doing. So I got the help of a guy in Australia who helped me set up the service and stuff and I went to university and had a nice income on the side. I think that first year, we turned over 18 grain, great part to start the show. So it seems like a life with no one Dark Nights of the soul. But was this actually the case? And where does he see the world of home broadcasting going in the future? More of the same or something quite different? Well, let’s find out as we bring on to the show to start Join Up Dots with the one and only James Mulvany.
James Mulvany [3:17]
Morning, James, how are you sir? I’m, I’m brilliant. You know what an intro David, I can’t believe the granularity you went to there. I feel like we actually don’t need to record the podcast because you’ve just summarise everything I was gonna say anyway.
David Ralph [3:30]
Well, can I tell you why I do that? James? Should I tell you? I was on about Episode Five of Join Up Dots. And it was right in the early days and I realised that most people come with their keynote storey but I like yeah, time and time again. So I just bought like m&m. in that film. I’m going to share the storey before they get to it and then we can go in any direction we want.
James Mulvany [3:54]
That’s a good idea, to be honest. I mean, I’ve got lots of I can elaborate on that storey as well. There’s bits that you missed out there. So
David Ralph [4:00]
We can go anywhere we want. So Mr. James Mulvany, thank you so much for being here and Join Up Dots because I am a fan and I want to get straight into radio.co. First of all, because this is a platform that I have looked at numerous times, and just recently down heart FM in the United Kingdom, got rid of their breakfast show hosts and they sort of amazing sort of centralised one. And the Essex guy who has been the unplug the radio host for about 25 years, came round to the back of the garden, Join Up Dots, I sat with him for an afternoon. And to be honest, I spent most of the time trying to promote radio.co saying, Look at this, you can do this yourself. You can get all the ex hosts have been sacked by heart, create your own radio show. This is brilliant. He wasn’t as excited as I was. Now. Do you find that you find that podcasters look at it and go wow, this is such an opportunity.
James Mulvany [4:59]
I think They are, there’s obviously some crossover between podcasting and radio, a lot of radio stations will run a podcast, not every podcaster wants a radio station. And one thing I can tell you is, we have a huge chunk of customers at Radio co who are ex jocks or ex presenters or whatever you want to call them. And they’ve decided that they want to leave the industry and start their own business and run their own online radio station, which can sometimes be you know, super focused around a specific topic or it can be super focused on a specific genre of music. And you know, they have a great time. And the great thing about that the platform is entirely cloud based. So you don’t have to have a fancy studio. And also you don’t have to be located in the same place as your DJ, your other DJ. So you can have people come and broadcast on your station from anywhere in the world. And you know, do it from the comfort of their own home or some people have like a home studio like you do the back of the garden or in their bedroom or whatever. And it just, you know, it kind of encourages creativity and collaboration, I think.
David Ralph [5:58]
Now, I listened to Chris happens the Breakfast Show guy in the United Kingdom he stole
James Mulvany [6:03]
you from radio to to virgin did he did
David Ralph [6:05]
he did yeah I know he’s and he stole me was is exactly the same show there’s no difference it’s just like he’s old show has been moved across but he was doing it all from Portugal on a laptop and even though I the same thing I was thinking my god it people out there aren’t grasping the fact that nowadays they don’t have to go to an office they could set up a tree and build a business. We’ve never got them we’ve never got them Join Up Dots is a failure it me and Chris Evans haven’t shown them a new way. That’s excellent you James but at its core business is about creating the lifestyle with the businesses second place,
James Mulvany [6:45]
I think. Yeah, to begin with, you know, like back in the day when I first started out, it was me on my own. And, you know, I was the sales guy, the support guy that you know, software guy, I did everything I want many hats, a bit of jack of all trades, master of none. But what it did give me his ability to sort of understand each area. And, you know, when I started hiring staff, you know, he allowed me to, for example, talking to developers, I have a good understanding of how it all links together and, and how code works. Don’t write any code anymore. But I think to begin with, and having that creativity and that freedom, and it was really like a lifestyle business back then, look, I think you mentioned in your introduction, I remember being in sixth form, start a website, I might go back then was like, Can I get my bank balance to 1000 pounds like this almost unachievable, you know, goal that was kind of and then I did it probably within the space of, I don’t know, five, six months. And I remember hitting that goal and thinking this is amazing, you know, and, and as you said, I think first year 16 years old, we turned over about 18 grand, which were 16 old kids not bad. And but you know, obviously then as time progresses and things grow, you know, it becomes more of a you know, more of a commercial entity I guess, you know, the we’ve got about 30 of us on the team now. So, you know, things are a bit different now than then. But I kind of still always have a, you know, like kind of fond memory those early days when it was just me and I was kind of, you know, I had that sort of opportunity ahead of me thinking I can just do anything I can take over the world with this. And it really gave me a lot of excitement. Because, you know, I think as you said in the introduction, my original plan was to go into radio as a broadcaster as a DJ, and sort of did a little bit of that. And then I kind of thought, Well, you know, I’m going to go off to university and sort of I studied interactive multimedia, which is basically web design and stuff like that. And you know, that that would kind of gave me the building blocks to sort of start growing the business a bit more.
David Ralph [8:45]
The amount of radio hosts that I have spoken to over the last two or three years and but majority of them say it’s so restrictive in radio, they spend most of these days doing maps and working out if I play a disagreement Song how long till the top of the hour and all that it’s just like mass mass mass and I can’t say anything. Now with Join Up Dots, I literally open my mouth and whatever comes out goes into people’s ears. And I can’t understand with the the growth and the explosion, why more people aren’t going that way? Why do people still want to get a job when you can create your own job, James?
James Mulvany [9:24]
I think it’s the security isn’t it? And it’s the fear of the unknown. If you’re a DJ and you’ve got that talent, you’ve got that, you know, core communication built within you that you can kind of get people on your side, you can, you know, that can be translated to so many different areas of running a business, you know, if you’re a good presenter, you can be a really good salesperson, you can be really good marketer, you know, you’ve got that ability to present a camera concepts and ideas, record videos, and I’ve really, especially in the early days, I really saw drew upon that, that talent, those skills, to launch the business and actually get kind of get one Over on the competition, because a lot of the competition were for focusing really on the technical aspects of everything, but actually, they weren’t good at sales. They, they were too scared. And I still see this today, they’re too scared to appear in front of a camera or too scared to actually go in front of a mic and actually start selling their products and speak to people. So I think, you know, as a creative person, if you’re in broadcasting for your podcasting, you know, you can take those skills and you can easily turn it into a business because so much of being a business relies on being a good communicator, a good communicator.
David Ralph [10:30]
I agree with you totally. And what I really picked up on there is how so many people try to sell based around the technical aspects. Yeah, but majority of people don’t give a monkey’s about the technical aspect. They they just want to know the end product. It’s the knowledge gap that you’ve got to cross it, sir. Yeah, we can show you how to live a life like this. We can show you how you sit in your underpants and create a business. We want to show you five. And these are the tools that get there. Now when I email@example.com. And obviously, we’re going Talk about podcast co as well. I looked at that, and I thought to myself, this is so sexy, but I could create my own show. Once I finished, somebody else goes live. And we can broadcast to the world, we could get a load of podcasters, together, boarding. And then I looked at it and thought, No, actually, I just like doing my own thing. I don’t want to be responsible for sort of other people. Is that a stumbling block as well? Do you see it where people look at and go, I love this, but actually, who’s going to manage it? I don’t. But the talent doesn’t want to be the studio manager.
James Mulvany [11:32]
I mean, yeah, it’s interesting. You mentioned this, and I think radio.co platform does make that process very straightforward. I’ve got to start off by saying the reality of managing people can sometimes be difficult. I ran a radio station here in Manchester called MCI live for two years. And unfortunately, we had to call it a day at the start of this year, mainly for commercial reasons. We were trying to pick up sponsorship. And we you know, we did, we did some small deals, but we ultimately we didn’t get that big headline sponsor, but we had a lot of fun in running it and it was a good guinea pig for the business. And we had a studio which was really cool. It was actually based above a convenience store which is kind of like a hipster cool convenience store and with there we have this sort of mezzanine level we thought let’s put a studio up there. So it was really good. But you know what managing day we had sort of lots of electronic music DJ presenters coming in and and organising that we probably had about 50 people at any one time. And obviously, the people came and went over the couple years, we ran it, but you know, coordinating 50 people was a big task we needed to have, you know, I had what, two three full time people working on that project. Just to kind of coordinate that. And also obviously handle things like the marketing Instagram, etc. But it was, you know, it was a big ask.
David Ralph [12:50]
And it was the time I used to run sales teams and insurance teams and at 10 to eight the phone rang. You realised it was somebody I can’t get mean I’ve got flu, and baby, but the next day they were in and there was so much hassle about trying to cover cover this. What would be your response? If somebody says to you, James, do I create a company with loads of employees? Or do I just create something very, very small, but provides me with a lifestyle. I may not be a millionaire, but I earn 100 pounds more of and I need each month to pay all my bills, have lovely holidays, have pub lunches and all kinds of little luxuries. So I’m nice. What would you say?
James Mulvany [13:36]
I think it depends on the individual. You know, by nature, I’m very ambitious. I’m now you know, pretty successful. But to begin with, I was I was just sort of earning a good living and then it kind of went from making a good living to having staff and obviously then it gets to the point where, you know, you’re making significant profit. I think that depends on what you want. You need to And also to begin with, when I was at university, I wasn’t I didn’t have any kind of ambition to have a company, which was turning over, you know, multiple million amounts. I wanted us to make a few quid on the side. But then obviously things change over time. And, you know, you kind of your business grows and then obviously you kind of get bit more hungry you think, well, let’s, let’s try and push ourselves further. So I think to start off with a lot of people, you know, who are perhaps working in a job, or they’re just starting out, they just finished school or college, and they may be looking into going to sort of university or whatever, there’s no harm and just running something as a lifestyle business. That’s what I did for probably five or six years before things started really taking off.
David Ralph [14:45]
And when when did it take off to a point that you realise because no matter how we sort of frame it, there’s a hassle running a business. They go serious? Yeah. When you get to that point when you actually think yourself, hang on, are we growing Fast Should I scale back? We all have those decisions in our heads where we think the flexibility that I did have when it was all fun and exciting, and we were coming in each day and everybody loved working with each other. It’s lost a bit of that. Do you remember that?
James Mulvany [15:14]
Yeah, I mean, you know, you have just like any job, you have good days and bad days, you know, you’ll have periods where you’ve got a But fundamentally, being an entrepreneur is about problem solving. Right? So, if I have, if I have, you know, stumbling things along the way, which Every business has, you know, your job as a, as a founder or entrepreneur is to find solutions to those problems. And yeah, of course, you have your ups and downs not every day you go in and you thinking, yeah, this is brilliant, but then there obviously there are highs or lows. It’s just that’s the kind of storey I think that’s the journey going as an entrepreneur, but I think the more experience you get, you know, you you mentally more equipped to deal with the downfalls and the pitfalls and the problems along the way and they don’t affect you as much you kind of take them on the chin a bit more to begin with, you know, I certainly found myself kind of quite erratic, you know, I had this big dear things really took off for us in about 2011 2012 struck a big deal with AOL who owned a product called outcast and that was the core sort of engine of our system. So things took off very quickly for us that was had a business good wave stream then I knew the deal wasn’t going to be there forever and I knew that it will might last five years or so. So but but it but it went as quickly as it came it went so I think it lasted about two and a half years that contract and you know, it was very it was good for us. We made a lot of money as a business. But then when it when it went away, you know, that really hit me hard for a year I was sort of, you know, in my own head, struggling and thinking God What am I going to do? I’ve got all these staff and everything’s going to come crashing down around me and everything I’ve worked for him you know, and kind of looking at all these extremes in my own head but actually reality was it did that didn’t happen, you know, and but it what it did do is forced me to kind of get my head together and figure out what what’s next? How can we do better? And how can we kind of go one over on this?
David Ralph [17:05]
And who supported you at that time when mentally but demons are in your head thinking, yeah, God, who was the one that you went to
James Mulvany [17:12]
need to speak to? You know, you speak to your friends, your family, and half the time, they’re just like, Yeah, he’s just whinging about this again. But, but then I think, you know, actually, ultimately, you’ve got to help yourself, you know, no one’s going to give you a magic solution to a problem. And especially in business, when you’re when you’ve got the reins, you know, it’s down to you to actually figure out right, am I going to keep going on this path? Are we going to choose a new direction to go in and how we going to solve this problem?
David Ralph [17:38]
Let’s play some words and then come back to James he is Oprah.
Oprah Winfrey [17:42]
The way through the challenge is to get still and ask yourself, what is the next right move? not think about, Oh, I got all of this stuff. What is the next right move? And then from that space, make the next right move and the next right move? Not to be overwhelmed by it because you know, your life is bigger than that one moment, you know, you’re not defined by what somebody says, is a failure for you, because failure is just there to point you in a different direction.
David Ralph [18:13]
Now I created Join Up Dots back in 2004, based out 2014, based around the words that Steve Jobs will say later on, and it’s been a mantra of mine, but I didn’t really understand it until recently. And just recently, James or about couple years ago, I went through a really bad sort of health phase, big wobble, everything went skew with and tix up, as we say over here, and I really struggle. Now through that speech by Oprah and fruit, a speech from Steve Jobs and the fact that I’m still talking in the best microphone now. I’ve got a totally different mindset. I now think to myself, if it goes bad, I will deal with it. If it goes bad in the future, I will deal with it. If it goes I just say That everything that’s thrown at me now. It just means me being quiet, looking at it and thinking, How do I get past this? And the fact that I’m now 50 years old or coming up 50 years old? And that’s the time James, you say, No, I don’t believe it. I don’t believe it. But I’m coming up 50 years old, and I have made a billion decisions, right decisions, wrong decisions. I have led me to this point. I totally think that what’s going to stop those decisions still occurring going forward, you know, until I get run over or die. Literally, I don’t think that anything can go wrong. I just think that if it does go wrong, I deal with it what you think?
James Mulvany [19:38]
I think you’re right. And I think one of the things I’ve learned about myself as well as you can, you can kind of go through periods where you become a bit complacent, right? If you don’t make any changes, everything’s going sweet. And, you know, you just sort of kind of get used to doing it and then almost go into a bit routine, which I think is fine. And you can do that for to a certain extent. Because ultimately, you know, when you’re launching a business And, as I said, I’ve launched today, probably something like six different companies over the years, couple of them have worked out, couple of them haven’t, some of them have sold on various different things. But you know, you go through each time you launch your business, you go for that intense period of hard work hard graft, not knowing if it’s actually going to pay off. And, you know, sometimes it’s, you know, it’s really got to be, you’ve got to throw your life into it for a year or so. But, you know, then, you know, once you’ve, you’ve sort of started reaching a certain level of success, you can actually take a step back and enjoy it. And I don’t think there’s anything wrong in doing that, you know, have a couple of years, we think, actually, you know, we’ve got systems in place to deal with most of the stuff now, you know, my job as a founder, you know, can kind of just be to keep everything ticking over for a couple of years. Until then you decide, either start another business or, you know, in my case, sometimes it’s got a right what can we do next? We got to start shaking things up now. And it’s interesting because, you know, just launched podcast co so that’s been, you know, radios very successful now. And, you know, we’re still pushing boundaries and still innovating. But it has been in terms of development wise, what we’ve been doing is quite been quite quiet for the last year because it is quite a mature platform now. But now I’m starting to think, right, we’ve had a kind of year off radio.co, almost not not a literally a year off, but you see what I mean? In terms of mean, I’m sort of putting my mindset into it. But now I’m thinking right, I need to go back in and focus on it again, for probably like a six month period and go kind of a bit more intense on it. Because, you know, we’ve, we’ve grown the team, so we could work on two businesses, which is important, I think, you know, it’s important to have, that you don’t don’t lose momentum in your existing business if you start a new one. But then, ultimately, is there’s only so much bandwidth a thing as an entrepreneur that you’ve got. So, you know, sometimes you need to give it your own one projects and sort of scale that what you’re thinking about on another project for a period of time, but then, you know, readjust that balance at some point.
David Ralph [21:58]
I now say to people Van Bashir, I’ve been retired. And I mean that I’ve been doing bad for 58. He’s not bad at all. But I’ve been doing stuff and I’ve been, you know, working on things. But it hasn’t been the room that I had a couple of years ago where it was all I have to get this going, I have to get this but some Oh, this is Yeah, this year has been very much about myself, looking at what I want, and I can now see what I want. And it’s not what I wanted at the beginning. Have you seen that with yourself that the original dream actually was just just starting dream is not the real dream?
James Mulvany [22:37]
Yeah, I think things change over time. Of course they do. And, you know, and also, I think, for me, I found, you know, what was caught I’ll bring this up, bring this up in a sermon, actually. But, you know, I think you, you kind of get you’re aware of your abilities and you know, once you’ve a certain level of achievement that you kind of, you know, I don’t think you should ever sort of stop you keep need to keep learning need to keep that hunger for more, I think but you can kind of think he actually, you know what, I kind of know what I’m doing a bit now. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, when I, when I was at university, I really didn’t know what I was doing. I was just winging it. And I kind of was just trying all these different ideas. And, you know, some things worked and some things didn’t. But you know, nowadays, I kind of got a bit of a better understanding of what my capabilities are where my sort of expertise lies, which I think is, you know, a good thing. But then I’m say, I’m not I’m not suggesting you should ever think, right, I’m done. Now, you know, because I think there’s always room to move forward. There’s always room to learn new skills of find out about new things.
David Ralph [23:38]
But isn’t that key to growing a business where probably 90% of the effort is learning about what you don’t know? Yeah, completely self developing and upscaling and I come back from the my wife says, you know, what you’ve been doing? Have you been recording podcasts? I say, No, no, I haven’t been doing it. I’ve just been reading stuff and looking at stopping and you have to be careful and this is a question You’re actually, when you realise that there are knowledge gaps. Do you delve into that deeper and deeper? And so you become the expert. And you kind of alluded to that at the beginning, but that’s your kind of your full bag. Or do you now go, okay, we need this, I can’t be bothered to learn it all myself, let’s just get someone in
James Mulvany [24:20]
a bit of both, you know, like, quiet. I love hiring talented people. And it’s a really good feeling. When you hire someone who knows way more than you do about subjects, and they, they’re fascinating because, you know, you couldn’t ever possibly learn or understand everything they know. And but then also, you know, I think sometimes you do, you know, you do things right. And, and certainly, I think actually sometimes have to go in tandem, if I take a new team member on who’s in an expert in a field that I perhaps don’t know that much about, you know, try and learn from them or try and at least get a good understanding of, you know, what, what they’re doing and how they’re going about it because I think it makes me a better boss, you know, and it also You know, just kind of gives you an idea of the value you’re getting from that person, I think,
David Ralph [25:03]
is I personally find it a struggle, because I’m somebody that likes to know the nuts and bolts. And when I used to run teams up in the City of London, I used to make sure. And it used to be a bone of contention, because their directors used to say, David, it’s your job to direct not do the work. And I used to say, I want to know every single job. So in fact, guy says to me is going to take an hour to do that bit of work, I can say no is going to take 10 minutes, you’re taking the piss basically. And so I wanted the experience of it. I find it very problematic running the business that I do now. But I’ve still got that in me, where I actually want to know as much about that as possible, which, in many ways will hold you back because as you say, at the very beginning, you become the master of everything master of none you saw you’re not specialising.
James Mulvany [25:53]
Yeah, there’s a great quote quote by Richard Branson, which I really like. I think it’s Richard Branson, and he said something along the lines of You know, don’t learn how to do something, pretend you know how to do it and say sell that service or sell the business and then figure out how to do it. And I think that’s a, it’s, it’s a dangerous line to tread sometimes if you say, yeah, we could do that, screw it, and you liking it. But yeah, but that I think, actually, you know, if you kind of do that in a controlled way, and you’re not kind of, you know, you have got good intentions behind you, you’re not just promising something and then trying to take people’s money and run off or whatever, you know, you want to actually deliver that service. I think that can certainly be a huge catalyst to push you to learn and discover new skills or or learn about a new industry or
learn about new sort of sector, whatever.
David Ralph [26:38]
Because that is fundamentally what business is, it’s about finding a customer that has that knowledge gap. And by adding that service for them, and I say to so many people through Join Up Dots now, it’s very easy to sell stuff before you’ve even got it. You know, get an early bird offer, get people to come in and instead of $1,000 they get it for her hundred dollars. And you can see how many people buy up on that. And then you can spend your time building it, you know, yeah, but you’re never losing out on stuff.
James Mulvany [27:08]
or worst case scenario, you know, it doesn’t work out, you only get two people buy $100 probably not a good market to go into refund those people send your apologies to them and then move on and learn from that. Because the quicker you can fail and learn from it. Sometimes it’s the better.
David Ralph [27:23]
Do you know what I mean? I know exactly what you mean. And I’ve done so much of spending six months building a product, but actually was just a dead dark, because I didn’t listen to what people actually wanted. Now, James, I spend more time talking to people one to one. My website is just open, you can book a time with me and I will schedule a chat with you. And it has made my business you know, 10 times as profitable because I’m actually finding out the problems I’m finding people are struggling with.
James Mulvany [27:56]
I completely agree with you that we are big on speaking to customers. You know, you said in the intro sort of stopped by hiding behind your computers, this is something I must have said at some point in the past, stop hiding behind your computer or actually go out and speak to people. And I was guilty of that, you know, in the early days, I was like, running an internet business for a reason, because I don’t want to speak to people kind of thing and I was, you know, I was that nerd in his bedroom in the early days. And, and, you know, fortunately, uni kind of bought me out of my shell a bit and, you know, gave me some better sort of interpersonal skills and also real sort may realise, actually, you don’t just literally be working 24 hours a day. There’s there’s more to life than that. But I think, you know, speaking to customers and having conversations is really important. And for many years, I avoided that we didn’t really take calls but now you know, you can book a demo with one of one of our team. They will talk to you they will find out about your ideas and give you advice based on if you’ve got an idea for a radio station or if you’ve got a good idea for a podcast and try and give you as much constructive feedback and how we can help as possible. Now that’s been a big difference for us. But as a business,
David Ralph [29:03]
yeah. Now let’s talk about podcast.co. Because Sure, I firstname.lastname@example.org. And I thought this is brilliant. This is the knowledge gap. I looked at him for our cards, you could create your own radio station, you can have, you know, we podcasting. I know that the majority of the world think that they can do it easily. They think that they can become a podcast host. You know, I changed my LinkedIn profile to Yes, another bloody podcast for a while just because I could see that everyone was launching five shows and then stopping they were all saying they were podcast host. What is the thing that will make people come across to podcast co against all the other hosting companies and people that provide those kinds of services?
James Mulvany [29:46]
Good question. I think we are still finding our feet in terms of podcaster. co we launched in May. The reason we launched was because we ran radio.co for four years and probably about two three years in, we saw that there was a lot of movement in the poker etc. So we thought, you know, ultimately, we want a slice of that pie as a business. But, you know, ultimately, there’s a lot of podcast hosts out there, which I believe are very antiquated now. And they haven’t really updated their user experience. You know, they’re kind of clunky and not very easy to use. And I kind of thought, yeah, we can do better. We’ve got a lot of expertise in that area in terms of building beautiful and easy to use products. And so we kind of took everything we’ve learned from regional CO and put it into a podcasting platform. And on top of that, we are full service. So we’re working more and more now with brands, like larger agencies, and talent management companies as well. So we’re doing a couple of podcasts for sports personalities, and really taking care of the whole process because again, someone who is, you know, let’s say football person, you know, and they’ve got a big public profile. They’ve got, you know, sort of contracts with you know, TV shows. They’ve got following on Twitter etc. That person doesn’t really want to learn how to actually do a podcast, they don’t want to have to learn what an RSS feed is, they just want to sort of come up, you know, turn up at the studio, or, you know, have you come to their, their office or their home or whatever it might be, record what they’ve got, and record quite often these people are really well connected. So they might have, you know, lots of other sort of famous friends. And, you know, have this is another channel of them communicating with their audience, their fan base, whatever you want to call them. So, we’re getting more and more involved with that. It’s very exciting. The good thing about that is it allows us to work with these people to launch very successful podcast very quickly, because, you know, basically, they’ve, they’ve already got the contacts to kind of produce a really hot show with people, you know, sort of, you know, well known brands or well known, well known sort of personalities. And, you know, we also work with them on monetizing it. So we’ve then got source of sponsor, so So that’s really where we’re kind of taking the business and we’re slow say we’re still kind of finding our feet, but it’s very exciting.
David Ralph [32:06]
I can see in that regard is very exciting because yeah, there’s a lot of people out there. You know, when I started in 2014, really Ricky’s your base was about the only celebrity doing podcasting. There was, yeah, there was only a few. Every single person has one hour. Now I’m gonna throw it over to you. I think a podcast is actually what we’re doing now. I’ve been keeps genuine, unique, authentic content. I don’t go a bundle. And I don’t think they should be called podcast of when a radio show strips off their daily content, puts it together and then launches a podcast based on that. So they have a load of celebrities. They come in every day, and then they take all the interviews, take the music off and say it’s a podcast. I argue that it’s not James, what do you think?
James Mulvany [32:54]
Well, I think a podcast is simply a downloadable audio file. So really, it can be anything that’s already I know what you mean, I think podcast like this for me and more engaging. And the amount of podcast I listened to and here was just content has been repurposed you know that someone will have a video channel and they’ll just take your video and turn into an audio which is fine and you know sometimes it can be listening well but actually I think you’re right when you having a genuine conversation between two people is exciting and you never really know where it’s going to go. And again, you know, what would you say about there’s a lot of podcasts out there would have done very well which are very highly produced audio drama type things. You know where it’s about it might be a fantasy storey or it might be something to do with you know, some true crime that’s happened in the past. You know, cereals a good example what do you think about podcast like that?
David Ralph [33:44]
I think they’re just audio books. Now my mom and dad but you drive along and put a CD in and listen to some Agatha Christie storey, you know, which is basically just you know, VAT cereal based on a disc You know,
James Mulvany [33:58]
it was old enough to remember tapes in the 90s you know, help tapes or that kind of Tony Robbins or Paul McKenna and all these kind of guys. They they did really well. Basically what is almost like a podcast, isn’t it but it’s just a bit the medium them is that the cassette tape, you go out, you buy it, you’ve listened to in the car or listen to it when you are, you know, doing the housework or whatever.
David Ralph [34:18]
I’ve actually got a Paul McKenna disc, which is like, I don’t know what it is, but I play it and it’s like a relaxation work. And it’s sitting there for ages. And then one day I was really really tired and I thought, oh, I’ll just play that and see what a banger went off. I went off and literally, I thought I’d been drugged or stoned or something. You know, right. No, was although I was convinced it work. But yeah, that was just like a sort of clever pre podcast Really?
James Mulvany [34:46]
Yeah, I used to buy I thought a few Port Macquarie books in the sort of mid 2000s and it used to give you know, part of the cell was you got free a CD, you know, with his so Hello, this is kinda and you know, it was it was good and and I you know, whenever phase where I was kind of really into that learning about that. And I found it actually looking at what they were doing as well as like what they were actually saying, I think as you can learn a lot from that by actually watching people, and you know, the fact that they bundled the CD with the book, and that made you pick up the shelf, or pick it off the shelf and want to buy it versus if it was just a book, you probably wouldn’t feel as compelled. You know, just little things like that will kind of mean the early days of my business were useful kind of marketing and sales of knowledge.
David Ralph [35:28]
In the 70s. I’m going even further back, I’m a lot older than you James. But in the 70s we used to have like these kind of floppy discs that they used to put on front of magazines. And so you would buy the magazine and get like three or four songs that you couldn’t get anywhere else. And it was just like floppy plastic that you played on your record player. And if people don’t know what a record player is, there’s a lot of people out there that don’t. You got that information. It’s all podcasting, but now it’s so instantly accessible. And that’s the thing that excites me and that’s the part that has Become the mantra of Join Up Dots where everything is already out there, everything’s already done. You’ve just got to see a different way of doing it and bring it to market. You know, I speak to so many people, James like, yeah, you know, I’m going to ask you this question. Actually, this is put me on a different thing. I do a lot of business coaching. And I teach people how to create their own online business and rock and roll. And a majority of them want to do the big sexy stuff right at the beginning. And I say to them, you build income in you grow competence, and then you find out where it’s sitting nicely. Let’s look about how to get a customer get a products, get some money into your bank account. It may not be your ideal, super sexy, finished business, which is the dream, but it gets you away from the corporate man, it gets you moving in the direction. Do you think nowadays, people need to understand that it’s not the business is the process of how these businesses work, which is Keeping to success?
James Mulvany [37:02]
I think so I think you make a very good point there. Customers are important without customers, you don’t have a business right? And you don’t have, you know, you need, you need to figure out how to get some money through the door. And I see so many people. And you know, I’ve done a bit of mentoring myself. And, you know, done a few talks and things, you know, and also some as people come to me and ask me questions, I think about starting a business, and about people who focus on all the wrong stuff, you know, let’s get my logo design then that’s my, you know, used to be like, let’s get the spent ages getting the business cards, and, you know, planning how business cars going to look which no one hands on, no one cares about anyway, but actually, they’re not thinking at all about, right, how do I go and get that first customer I think that’s so crucial that you know, a route to market you’ve got a little bit of a model, you know, you know how much you’re going to charge for a product, you know, that there’s demand there and I think you know, actually starting with that, and then worrying about all the other junk later like how fancy your website is all you know, designing your business is crucial.
David Ralph [37:57]
I saw a post the other day on Facebook, where A guy who’s been on Join Up Dots and he’s doing very well for himself basically made a comment of, if you’re going to slack me off for trying to sell you stuff, Bane, you’re never going to be an entrepreneur. That’s what entrepreneurs have to do. We had to sell stuff. And I read it and I reflected on my own journey where I used to work up in the City of London doing sales calls cold calling, rounding out people, like get on the phone, I tried to flog them some banking service and stuff. When I got into my own world, I tiptoed around selling and promoting because I found it was like, I don’t know, it didn’t sit comfortably with me. But I was saying to people, look, I want your money, and I’m going to show you how to do stuff or I’m going to give you a service and did you find that as well a bit of a stumbling block at the beginning actually marketing your services and actually saying, This is what I do.
James Mulvany [38:52]
I think I wasn’t very good at it. But no, I think I was good in the sense that actually to begin with, you know, to reward 2004 just in, in school studying in sixth form college. And, you know, I wasn’t really very technical, I didn’t actually know how to deliver this service. So I was I wanted to sell a kind of new bits about it. But I found this guy in Australia who who did online, you know, power of the internet and got him to sort of do that techie behind the scenes stuff. Actually, the first thing I did was learn to build a website, which sold a product. Now, as I say, I wasn’t very good. Now I look back at it, I think, Wow. You know, it was all right, you know, for someone who really didn’t, you know, have any prior experience. But, you know, the messaging was a bit weird. And, but, but then, of course, you know, from that I learned and I sort of reiterated and reiterate and reiterated over the following couple of years, and then when I went off to university, and you know, slowly got better at that. So it was kind of really soccer self teaching outside but, you know, that was that was kind of where I started, but then I kind of started I think in the right way around in terms of I was selling and then I figured out the technical stuff afterwards.
David Ralph [40:02]
And what is brilliant about your products is the messaging is spot on radio.co podcast co as soon as I go on there, I know exactly what it is it It fits my three second rule. And you’ve already sold me because I understand so quickly. You know with Join Up Dots I always say to people Join Up Dots is a stupid name until you listen to the show and when it makes sense, but as an actual branding as a messaging is totally off whack. radio.com and pod cast.co Have you had other thoughts? Did you think of doing anything more kind of sexy and not blatantly obvious,
James Mulvany [40:41]
the radio.co domain I bought that in 2013, right. And I spent a lot of money on it. It was obviously a domain that you know, you can’t just freely register someone had already taken it. So I bought that, you know, effectively kind of through escrow and through an auction and paid you know, really substantial some more spent on anything but I just had a good feeling about it. I knew I was in the radio industry was selling services to the radio industry. But you know what I bought that. And I didn’t actually know what I was going to do with it at the time. The idea of radio.com was the platform that it is now wasn’t really fully formed. I think. I just knew it was going to be a good brand, a strong brand, and it was kind of it was summarising exactly what we did wave streaming, you know, it’s got the word streaming in and it got the word wave, which was playing radio waves. That was how I came up with that. And it was great, but very technical, you know, you’ve got a bit of a techie person. And I think nowadays most people know what the word streaming means. Back in like 2000, late 2000s. No one really knew what streaming meant. So I had a hard time explaining what I did to people whenever like, so what do you do? Well, I sell streaming service. What’s that? You know? So I think, you know, radio is the kind of core of what we do. It’s a big bowl brand. But hopefully it’s simple, isn’t it?
David Ralph [41:56]
It’s totally simple. And that is where businesses You You have an offering, you go and find the people that really want that offering, and you sell it to them. And it’s just, you know, it’s as simple as that. But people make it so complicated. Everything can Join Up Dots. If it doesn’t operate within three moving parts. I think it’s too complicated. I literally have somebody comes across to the website, they get the option of speaking to me, I speak to them and then they decided they want to the product at the end of it and it has become so streamlined and simple, but everything’s about Click Funnels and sales funnels and bass going off here and that going off air and email automation and does it does that drive you mad as well James, but yeah, I’m saying let’s keep the customer as far away from us as possible. We’re actually let’s talk to the customer.
James Mulvany [42:46]
Well, I think there is some sort of truth in building funnels right. And if you’re trying to scale a business, you need to think about the different segments of the market and talk to them the language they understand and there’s different you know, different way from white roots into say podcasting. Some people are Running a business, some people want to do it from their bedroom. Other people are running, you know, working in a marketing department for a charity, for example, and the way you can kind of speak to those different people and advertise those sort of different sectors completely different. So funnels do have a sense, but I do think in terms of, you know, breaking down the barriers to actually getting through to someone and speaking someone and I think, too many people when they’re starting an internet company, they’ll fall into the trap of buying courses, buying loads of products, or the services, which kind of claim to be the, you know, the magic silver bullet or whatever it’s called, you know, to sort of, you know, make them millions of pounds or whatever it might be, you know, there’s so much bs out there in this industry, and people selling kind of hopes and dreams, and that annoys me Actually, and, you know, I spent again, when I when I was at uni, I spent loads of time looking at all these sort of salesy spammy websites and just thinking, you know, maybe I could learn something, actually, a lot of it’s just look at what they’re doing rather than buying what you’re selling you I think a lot of the time, but then I think actually having you know, having a big This coach or someone to speak to is probably very valuable. Because you know, you can ask them to you can ask them kind of tailored questions and get tailored responses, rather than just reading a book or doing a video course, which is just generic.
David Ralph [44:13]
Yeah, I agree with you totally. Well, I’m gonna play the words from my business coach, and I’ve been listening to these every single day. Here is Steve Jobs.
Steve Jobs [44:21]
Of course, it was impossible to connect the dots looking forward when I was in college. But it was very, very clear looking backwards 10 years later. Again, you can’t connect the dots looking forward, you can only connect them looking backwards. So you have to trust that the dots will somehow connect in your future. You have to trust in something, your gut, destiny, life, karma, whatever. Because believing that the dots will connect down the road will give you the confidence to follow your heart, even when it leaves you off the well worn path, and that will make all the difference.
David Ralph [44:56]
Well, you’ve created your own path and you’re at the point where you You you literally can go in any direction, you’ve got a success, blueprint to follow in certain regards, how much of those words still apply to your life now, James moving forward, or do you think you’ve gone past that point?
James Mulvany [45:14]
I think Well, like I said earlier, you know, never stop learning. Like one of the things I’ve been getting into more recently is property development. I’ve got a few rental properties. Now, it’s industry, I didn’t really understand or know anything about two years ago. You know, so that’s for me, like one of the new things I’m getting myself getting my teeth into. And again, there’s different ways different things, you can do different, like, models that you can follow. So I find that very interesting. And, and also, I spent a lot of time over the past 10 years building brands right, building a company and although I’ve always been quite happy to be the face of those brands, I’ve been on videos, and I’ve been on podcast like this one. And that kind of thing. I’ve never really spent a lot of time pushing my own personal brand. And that’s becoming a big thing. What has become a big thing over the last two, three years. So that’s kind of something else. I’m getting into I’ve actually just hired another colleague, who’s starting the end of November, and his job is just solely going to be working with me on my personal brand. You know, and and managing social media and stuff, because again, I haven’t, you know, I’ve only got so many hours in the day, I’m running two businesses. So this is something I need help with. I can’t, I can’t actually just do it all myself. So you know that there’s always things that you can be sort of learning or kind of getting into and I don’t think you should ever stop.
David Ralph [46:29]
I agree. 100%. Well, I’m not going to stop. And I’m not going to stop this episode until I’ve taken you on a final journey. And this is the part that we call the Sermon on the mic when I’m going to send you back in time to have a one on one with your younger self. And if you could go back in time and speak to young James, what advice would you give him and what he would you like to speak to what we’re going to find out because I’m going to play the music and when it beats you up, this is the Sermon on the mic.
Unknown Speaker [47:00]
Unknown Speaker [47:00]
go with the best.
James Mulvany [47:16]
So we said we were going to do this in a kind of godly voice. So you’re on the right track Boy, you make sure you stick at it. But also keep focused because it’s very easy to get distracted and kind of go off on tangents. So keep focused, and but also stop rushing, you’re very young, you’ve still got plenty of time, you don’t have to achieve results overnight. And you’ve got a few years in which to make a success of yourself. sound a bit like Santa Claus. And also speak to people and network and you know, get off your computer go out there in the real world and you know, have a chat. That was kind of a really bad sound bad, God like voice out to make out some echo to that.
David Ralph [47:56]
I know it we do it as it is, and it’s out there. He’s out there instantly. I don’t fat around with it after that. But James, what is the number one best way that our audience can connect with you?
James Mulvany [48:07]
Right? So I’m on LinkedIn, James Mulvany, you can also follow my social media accounts. It’s at create, reach, inspire. And if you go on create Rich inspire.com, you can find out more about me, this is my new personal brand that I was just talking about. So still very early doors, but I’m going to be pushing out tonnes of content over the next year. And about things like growing your audience of radio station or podcaster. And how to start a successful internet business. And also just give you some behind the scenes look into my life. And also how, you know I run two businesses,
David Ralph [48:41]
right staff Well, we will have all the links on the show notes. And James, thank you so much for spending time with us today. Join those dots and please come back again, when you’ve got more dots to join up because I do believe that by joining up the dots and connecting our past is the best way to build our futures James, thank you so much. Thank you David,
James Mulvany [49:00]
it’s been a total blast. I’ve really enjoyed it. And you know what a great hour has been good fun.
David Ralph [49:06]
Mr. James Mulvany, right? So he starts in his bedroom and he looks around and he sees something that he’s interested in and he starts working towards it. And then he finds somebody that can help him with the things he can’t do. And little by little, it gets it. Now one of the things that you may not sort of reflect on is he talks about 2000 or in 2011. You know, these guys that come on the show is not overnight success. Nobody has an overnight success. There’s always a journey behind it. And if you start your journey now, you’re going to be at your destination, but much quicker. If you wait till next week, you’re going to be a week behind. So it really is important for you to start looking around and thinking to yourself, how do I shift things up? How do I change things up to make a difference and of course, at Join Up Dots, we’re there to speak to you all the way you can always be book a link with us and I will I will talk to you TN live. Until next time, I will see you again Look after yourselves and thank you to James probably. Are you ready to start your own podcast and really make it work for you bringing customers and profits into your life and your business in the easiest way possible, or perhaps you’ve already launched and aren’t getting the results you want? If so, I’m going to teach you the information that you need that makes all the difference to your success. Now, don’t be fooled into believing what others are teaching you when it comes to what makes your podcast get those results. podcasting success is not about the podcast. It has nothing to do with the recording or equipment. It has everything to do with understanding your market and making those customers come to you time and time. Again, this is raw 100% live behind the scenes podcasting mastery, not shown anywhere else. If that’s of interest, head over to Join Up Dots and book a time to speak with me to make sure that you’re a bit but our next course. This is podcasting mastery live Join Up dots.com