Welcome to the Join Up Dots business coaching podcast Interview with Mr Matt McWilliams
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Introducing Mr Matt McWilliams
And you’ll see why I haven’t written the thing myself this time.
“I’m a world changer.
Now before you think I’m an egotistical, too-big-for-my-britches, jerk, I think we are all world changers. If we weren’t born to change the world, we’re unnecessary.
In a nutshell, I arrived at my world changer philosophy after being fired four times (twice by the same company and once by my own dad…just try to top that!), after facing 42 years in prison.
How The Dots Joined Up For Matt
After starting two companies that rose and fell like the Roman Empire, and after getting married, having a wonderful wife and then daughter, I finally realized my true purpose in life.”
So where do I start first?
With the 42 years prison stretch?
Or that Dad who sacked him? That is harsh in anyone’s book.
Or perhaps I should go with the moment Matt McWilliams, found his own path in life, that has been world changing for him and of course the world?
Or perhaps we should just probe into his skills of affiliate marketing which has been so lucrative for him both personally and professionally over the years?
Well let’s bring onto the show to start joining up dots, as we discuss the words of Steve Jobs with the one and only Matt McWilliams
During the show we discussed such weighty topics with Matt McWilliams such as:
How we are all entrepreneurs at heart especially as very young children!
How to find your audience and then ask them what they want before providing that very thing!
Why he thought he was a punk as a young man, and shouldn’t have been voted into politics when he tried!
How he didn’t work hard enough at school and regrets that now his dream of being a PGA golfer went out of the window!
How you are either entering into a crisis, or coming out of one in your life!
How most opportunities will be there the next day so go ahead and sleep on them!
How To Connect With Matt McWilliams
Return To The Top Of Matt McWilliams
You can also check our extensive podcast archive by clicking here – enjoy
Audio Transcription Of Matt McWilliams Interview
When we’re young, we have an amazing positive outlook about how great life is going to be. But somewhere along the line we forget to dream and end up settling. Join Up Dots features amazing people who refuse to give up and chose to go after their dreams. This is your blueprint for greatness. So here’s your host live from the back of his garden in the UK, David Ralph.
David Ralph [0:26]
Yes, good morning to you. How are you? I’m coming through loud and clear. And my guest is coming through amazing clear today. We record all these on Skype. And sometimes it’s a little bit iffy. But today, the audio quality is like he is sitting on my lap. And maybe that’s the image that he wants. I’ll be honest with you. And we have been chatting just before pressing the record button. And it did get a little bit x rated. So I might start doing some evening shows and not tell the guests that we’re recording of and put it out a little bit later. I don’t know I might go with that. But let’s introduce you to today’s guest and he is a man who, well, I don’t do this very often. But the introduction is actually in his own words. And you’ll see why I haven’t written the thing myself this time. These are these words taken from his website and couldn’t have done any better. I am a world changer. Now before you think I’m an egotistical, too big for my britches, jerk. I think we’re all well changes. If we weren’t born to change the world were unnecessary. In a nutshell. I arrived at my world changing philosophy after being fired four times, twice. I shouldn’t laugh at that twice by the same company. And once by my own dad just trying to talk bad. And after facing 42 years in prison after starting two companies that rose and fell like the Roman Empire. And after getting married, having a wonderful wife and Ben daughter, I finally realised my true purpose in life. Wow, there’s so many things that I need to talk about. But where do I start first with the 42 years prison stretch, or that dad who sacked him and that is harsh in anyone’s bought. Or perhaps I should go with a moment he found his own path in life that has been well changing for him. And of course, the world. Or perhaps we should just probe into the skills of affiliate marketing, which has been so lucrative for him both personally and professionally over the years. But there’s so much more to him. And I’m going to love this conversation, as I bring on to the show to start joining up the dots of these live, but one and only Matt McWilliams. How are you today? Sir?
Matt McWilliams [2:25]
I am doing great, David. And you know, I really enjoyed just hearing my own storey and a British accent. It’s it’s like 50% better hearing it in your accent. So
David Ralph [2:34]
thank you. We are basically all Englishman Americans and always kind of said they either think we’re like James Bond or Hugh Grant. It seems to be that is the stereotypical Englishman.
Matt McWilliams [2:49]
Yeah, it really did sound good. Plus the you know, you had me sitting in your lap. This was I knew this was going to be a good call. Once you once you said that.
David Ralph [2:58]
Well don’t wiggle around too much. You might knock the mic. You You have actually got one of those names. I’ll be honest, I’ve been struggling with your name. It’s like a tongue twister, isn’t it? Matt McWilliams, Matt. Matt Williams. Yep. How many times can you say your name fast? Can you do it five times really quickly and not screw up?
Matt McWilliams [3:16]
Oh, let’s see Matt McWilliams, Matt McWilliams, Matt McWilliams, Matt McWilliams, Matt McWilliams. It’s actually it’s an Irish name. So over in, in your neck of the woods and my, my family is, is half Scottish. So somehow we ended up with an Irish last name, though. But going back in time, we traced it back and my my dad side of the family where the name came from, of course, is or Scottish Highlanders. Way back in the back in the day.
David Ralph [3:46]
You know that the strangest name that I’ve had recently is Marc Seaver crop. I’ve had this guy on my show. And that was quite an unusual surname. But yours is kind of unusual in the whole sense. But it’s it’s the it is not easy to say is even harder. If you say Matthew, are you actually a Matthew?
Matt McWilliams [4:05]
I am. And I’m glad you brought up Marc Seaver crop because I know we had talked in the pre show that you and I were going to try to work that name in. So that was that was a good working of the name. And so shout out to mark. But yeah, Matthew, and my middle name is Ryan and last name McWilliams.
David Ralph [4:22]
So let’s get right into it that the show is Join Up Dots. And you was obviously introduced to me by the aforementioned Marc Seaver crop, you say I’ve done it again. I’ve got three or up to three, three times in the first four minutes, right. That’s the end of it. We can’t keep doing it. And so he introduced you to the show. And when I get names through, there’s certain names I kind of go I’ve never heard of this person at all. But they sound interesting. And your name was a name that I thought hang on I I’ve heard you before, and I couldn’t quite place it. But I realised my going back in time, but I heard you first on the solo printer hour with Michael O’Neill many moons ago.
Matt McWilliams [5:06]
Yeah, that was probably seven, eight months ago that I was on his show.
David Ralph [5:12]
And the thing that resonated with me at that time on his show, and I I’d kind of forgotten about it. But it was like niggling away in the back of my mind, was the fact that you were extremely proficient on at affiliate marketing, ie, making money in a passive way online. But that was just a part of your game, because the bigger part is the kind of caring sharing side when you literally reach out and help people to change their lives, which is unusual. When people are affiliate marketers, mainly, that is their thing, and they just go down that route. How come if you have come, you’ve got the two sort of areas of your life that’s working at the same time?
Matt McWilliams [5:55]
Yeah, it’s funny, you would ask that because they they do, they are so different. Now granted, you know, there are times when they tie together. A good example is my first consulting client. About three, three years ago. It was a small, small business owner. Somewhere in the neighbourhood of right at about six figures in revenue, I think it was actually just south of six figures. And I started consulting him. And we spent about 20 hours together, I was helping him grow his business, mostly on the affiliate side. And we talked a year later, little follow up interview, you know, just to check in with them, we become pretty good friends over over time. And I asked him how things are going, he’s like, man, things are great. We broke, this was in November of 2012. Cydia, we’ve already broke $200,000. This year, we just moved into a new home, we’re finally able to get a four bedroom home because he’s got two kids, and they can each have their own room, we finally we got the four bedroom home, they are great, we’re sending, you know, sending our daughter to a new private school, and the business is booming. And life is great. And I’m thinking, Well, that was that kind of married those two things there because I didn’t go into this, at least mentally, with the perspective of I could change this guy’s life, I could actually possibly change his family tree. But it did. So it’s kind of fun when I get to to marry those two things and, and take my my message my my inspiring message of being a world changer. and combine it with this know how in a rather boring subject of affiliate marketing and setting up affiliate programmes and affiliate management. So they’re, they’re two things that don’t normally day in and day out, don’t mesh very well together. But they’re two passions of mine, I’m very passionate about helping small businesses set up affiliate programmes and run them successfully. I’m very passionate about helping business owners make more money and be more efficient with their businesses. But I’m also very passionate about inspiring people to know what their what their God given worth is and what they were created to do. Because my philosophy is that everyone was put here with the purpose of changing the world in some way, shape, or form, or else they’re unnecessary. And that sounds cruel, but I believe it’s true. And so it’s kind of fun when when I get to mesh those two together occasionally.
David Ralph [8:22]
What do you think bad, but everyone has been put on for a purpose. Because I I agree with that. And I think some people out there listening on the bus on the train or whatever will go, No, that’s absolutely stupid. I am just an employee, and I’m going into work. But I would say to them, is just you haven’t found your thing yet. How do you get that concept? And how have you realised that with other people?
Matt McWilliams [8:51]
Well, I think it goes back to you know, you mentioned a little bit of my storey in the intro. The fourth time that I was fired, which would be the second time by the same company. This is not the time my dad fired me. And this was long after I’d been in handcuffs after being indicted by a grand jury on seven felony counts and facing 42 years in prison long after those exciting and enjoyable times in my life. I was fired for the fourth time. Thankfully, I had that consulting business on the side that was was bringing in just south of enough money to survive on and we were we were very fortunate and blessed. We’ve been very disciplined with our finances, we had more than enough money saved up. We weren’t worried about things financially. But I remember that day that I was fired, it was a Saturday. And I always joke with people and say, you know, here I am, I’ve got a newborn, probably she was five months old, got a brand new house we just bought, I’ve got a stay at home mom is my wife. So we went from having five months before we went from having two incomes to one. And I’ve just been fired. And it hit me that I should change the world. And I look on people’s faces when I say that is priceless. Because a lot of them believe me that that was the moment I decided to change the world. That was when the reality is that was just that was the moment I decided to weep like a four year old and, you know, go into a deep depression for a couple of days before I finally came up out of it.
David Ralph [10:23]
The Detroit angels and you know, oh, and oh, and rays of light coming down on you. And you had this this epiphany,
Matt McWilliams [10:33]
no angels, but I did have the London Symphony Orchestra playing in the background there. I had this it was just so peaceful that for those three or four days after I got fired, but you know, I did come out of it. And somewhere along the lines over the next few months, I developed this philosophy and it was just, it just kind of hit me one day, I written a post about entrepreneurs ship. And really what the, what the post talked about was that we’re all entrepreneurs, we’re all meant to change the world. And I went back into my own childhood, I started thinking about my friends, I started thinking about, you know, people that I’ve heard over the years, and I realised we really are all entrepreneurs at heart, like deep down inside of us. I at least everybody I’ve ever known on any personal level, we all had these crazy businesses when we were kids, you know, we all had these, the door to door businesses or we all we all looked at these problems in the world, we said, I can solve that problem. You know, that was the attitude I had when I was five years old, six years old, seven year old was I saw a problem my neighbourhood I’m like, I can fix that. I might have had no resources to do it. No ability, no know how. But I thought I could fix the fix everything in the world. And I thought that I had this immense power inside of me when I was very, very young. And I don’t know, when that changes in people. Like I know, for me, it wasn’t this cataclysmic event when I was eight years old, somebody said something to me, and it changed my view of the world. It just kind
David Ralph [12:09]
of it, I can stop you. But I can tell you when. And I think it changes for people, when they start having their first failures before then when you have five year old, nothing ever goes wrong, because you’re supported and you’re nurtured. And so you know, if you ask a five year old, what do you want to be? They’re gonna say astronauts, they’re gonna say princesses, they’re gonna say all these amazing things, because there’s no realise ation of failure. But once you get a little bit older, when it starts coming in, when you realise that you’re not superheroes,
Matt McWilliams [12:42]
you know, and that could be and it is a very great, I believe it’s a very gradual process. And so the, the, I can solve that I need to do something about this. I, I should, you know, I should fix that problem. As we get into teenage years or adult years starting, it’s becoming well, somebody needs to do something about that. You know, I, I wish somebody would fix that. I wish, why doesn’t somebody do something? You know, that’s the attitude shifts from that. And just like that person that you said earlier, I’m just an employee, you know, it’s that mentality, because I’m saddened, you know, I’m angered. And I’m saddened when I when I hear in see people think like that and talk like that, that somebody needs to do something about some problem, or somebody needs to, somebody needs to invent something. And I know, we can all invent something, we can all create the iPhone, we can’t all be Steve Jobs, we can’t all be Bill Gates, and we can’t all be so and so you know, not only one person gets to invent the telephone for the first time, you know, that’s Alexander Graham Bell, nobody else can be like him again. But there, there are so many things in this world that we can all impact. And maybe you are just an employee, maybe you’re an employee it I should say. But that doesn’t mean that you can’t change the world from that. Because I there are a lot of people who were just employees, and I’m using a little air bunnies with my fingers. Right now, there are a lot of people at Apple, who were just employees who’ve completely transformed this world. There are a lot of people at NASA, who were just employees of NASA, who are responsible for you being able to see pictures of the Earth from space right now. And so all of these things were done, in a way, by just employees, it doesn’t you don’t have to be an entrepreneur, to change the world, although I do think it helps to do you know what I think as
David Ralph [14:37]
well, I think one of the things that holds people back, and it almost held me back from doing this show, was the fact that there were other podcasts already out there. Somebody else has already invented the phone. Somebody else has already invented the car. And you kind of you brand these things in little pockets. Where actually if you logically go, okay, somebody else’s design the car, how many different brands or car are there? How many different types of phone, how many different types of podcast, we can all do our own thing in those those little markets and be very, very successful. But because we look at the big picture, oh, it’s already been done. We don’t even try it.
Matt McWilliams [15:20]
Well, and everybody has a unique thing. I mean, think about how many podcasts Do you listen to David,
David Ralph [15:26]
I used to listen to a lot. And when when I this is this is the truth of this. I used to listen to a lot and but when I started to get the idea of doing the show, I started to get scared by the amount of competition out there. So I closed it down. So in my tiny little mind, I kind of almost convinced myself, I was only against three or four people instead of I don’t know 100 million or whatever’s out there at the moment. And so that was my my, my trick. But I do still go back to the soda printer, our Michael O’Neill, if anybody hasn’t listened to that show, jump across, I do still listen to Entrepreneur on Fire, and the nerdiest, I think they’re the three but I sort of them, I listened to when I’ve got a moment.
Matt McWilliams [16:12]
And even then, if all you listen to us, three, four, or five, or if you’re like, my readers, I do not have a podcast yet. But I’m strongly considering launching one and I probably will within the next 30 to 60 days from when we’re recording this, but you know, I pulled them I surveyed them at the beginning of the year. And I asked you how many? How many podcasts do you currently listen to. And 30 something percent of them said 10 plus. So if the end, I think the average was somewhere in the neighbourhood of seven. So if the average person at least that reads my blog listens to seven podcasts. But what what is the big deal about adding an eight it’s not like I’ve asked them to completely transform their life, you know, adjust their schedules, and they have to wake up a half hour earlier every day, listen to a 15 to 30 minute show. That’s not the case, they’ll they’ll add it in, maybe they’ll listen to maybe they won’t listen to every episode of mine. And they’ll replace a couple of episodes of so and so’s show with a couple of mine. It’s not a life changing thing. As much as I’d like to think it’s not a life changing thing, meaning again, they’re not having to adjust their schedules. And not to mention in your case, you know how many awesome how many podcasters are interviewing awesome people like Marc Seaver crop.
David Ralph [17:29]
He is that isn’t he
Matt McWilliams [17:32]
that are British, you know, and there is that to make, make light of the accent, but hey, you know, it’s fun to listen to British people. And so how many people are doing what you’re doing or having, you know, different types of people and I’ve listened to a couple of your episodes, I mean, they, they were very vastly different people. So there’s always a spot for, for different types of shows or different types of things. And there’s, there’s Apple, and there’s windows, there’s how many different computer companies are there, I mean, in there really not a tonne of difference between them. But there’s always room for some small improvement. And, and I highly encourage people if they have an idea if they have something but there’s there is competition out there, then just think of the ways that you can be ever so slightly different. Or think of the audience that you can, can reach with that message when my message of of, if you look at my target audience, or at least based on the surveys, what my audience actually is, it’s a little bit diverse. But typically, the motivational, you know, the change the world philosophy message, is it really geared towards the 35 to 54 year old, predominantly male income of $75,000 or more type person, it’s typically geared more towards the teenage, young adult, you know, that sort of crowd, but I’m targeting people who aren’t normally targeted for that. And I’m still reaching out to them. And it’s, it’s changing people’s lives. I mean, just based on the emails and the notes I get in the mail and the comments on the blog, it’s changing people’s lives. So I have the same message is so many other people, I’m just hitting a different audience that only I have, can or have been able to so far to be able to hit.
David Ralph [19:30]
But let’s let’s take you back because I love the passion that you have. And it’s so good. It is good passion. You know, you’re you’re there with your heart in the right place. So how did you get into a position where you were facing 42 years in prison? Was it just a series of mistakes? Or was it about you as an evil person in the old days?
Matt McWilliams [19:52]
It was the very short version of that storey I don’t mind sharing it, I think I would imagine if you if you go to Matt McWilliams, calm and just do a search for the word handcuffs. I pretty sure I’ve written less than four post that mentioned the word handcuffs. So you’ll find the it’s I think the title of it is like that time I was arrested or something like that. But yeah, what happened was I was running in 2002. I ran for the local school board in in North Carolina where I was living at the time where I was born and raised for about half my life. I was running for the Board of Education. And I made it through the primary. I was the youngest person in the history of North Carolina to make it through a primary election. At that time. I don’t know if I still am. I made it through the primary and then got just beat like a drone in the general election. It wasn’t even close. I lost by a mile. And fast forward two years later, and I announced that I’m running for the State House of Representatives. I’d been convinced that I was the best known possible candidate. So I ran was announced that I was running against the the CO speaker of the North Carolina House of Representatives. In other words, the third or fourth most powerful politician in the state of North Carolina. He’d been in the house since I was probably in grade school at the time, and his nickname was Boss Hogg. If that gives you any indication as to his personality boss. Hogg is a reference to the Dukes of Hazzard.
David Ralph [21:25]
Yeah, we had that store. We Yeah, we loved it. And I never understood why they never opened their doors. They always just jumped out the window. What was that about?
Matt McWilliams [21:35]
But anyhow, that’s that’s what it’s in reference to, you know, he was he was a ruthless man. And I ran against them. And so somehow they ended up investigating my campaign, and they found nothing. On the statehouse campaign, it was a squeaky clean as it could possibly be. I had a great team in place who kept great records, all of that stuff. Well, they went back and investigated my school board game in pain. And in that school board campaign, I forget the exact amount it was under $200. There’s about $165. That they found a discrepancy on and, you know, it was a I ran a $7,000 campaign, maybe of which 5000 of it was my own money. And there was 165 $70, whatever the number is mistake. And it wasn’t, it was a mistake that I knew about, well, I’d forgotten about it clearly. But they asked me about is like, yeah, we lied on our on our financial report. Well, what it was, is we lost a couple of receipts. And I basically just asked my treasure to just make up the numbers and like figure out somewhere to put that. And we could not document it. Well, the thing is, you sign your campaign finance reports, under oath, you actually go and raise your right hand, but you’re signing them under oath. And it says on there, if you lie on this year, basically committing perjury, hmm. Well, the problem is, you sign them, you fill those out every quarter, and then you fill out one final one. So there were five quarters in my election cycle. And then the final one, so I filled out six of these, well, they they compound, your, you’re not just filling out the one for that quarter, you’re filling out the one and re ascertaining everything from the one before. So it it is a bit extreme to say, you know, there’s some shock value in saying I was facing 42 years in prison, because if you know anything about the American legal system, they never give you what you actually could get you there’s always a plea bargain. And I plea bargained down to two years probation, 90 days house arrest and some community service. So I’ve worn handcuffs, I’ve worn an ankle bracelet. I’ve been in jail. And and technically, I’ve been indicted on seven or six of six felony counts of seven years each night. 746 like I said earlier, so I’ve been indicted on by grand jury and all that fun stuff.
David Ralph [23:57]
So when you in jail sitting there, Standing Bear was it was it a moment when you thought okay, this this really this has gone bad. This has gone pear shaped, as we say over here. I really need to focus when I come out, or was it a kind of thing going? Because because from what you were saying now, I was thinking, wow, that that was just a Paper Chase. It was just a few things gone slightly wrong, you know, you didn’t deserve what you were getting. How did you personally sort of take it?
Matt McWilliams [24:27]
I was a punk about it. I still remember. You know, initially, when well, backing up to how I was in jail, I actually knew the deputy sheriff, I actually helped get the sheriff elected. And so I knew the sheriff from the deputy sheriff and he apologise for having to put handcuffs on me. And I learned if you’ve ever seen a photo of somebody walking out of a sheriff’s office on the front page of a newspaper, which I did make the front page of the newspaper The next day, and they look like they’re hiding from the camera. It’s actually because they strategically I swear they place the exit of the sheriff’s office directly into the setting sun. So I walk out I’m not wearing sunglasses, and I walk out from this dark Sheriff’s Office into this bright light with a photographer, flashlight, my eyes, and I cover up my face. And so that’s what made the front page is the next day which is great when your mom and dad are both local, along with the rest of your family and they get to see their their son or nephew or cousin on the front page of the paper with handcuffs on that was fun. But as I’m in as I’m in jail, it really wasn’t a big deal. Because again, I knew the deputy sheriff, I was with him the whole time. They were just fingerprinted me and all that. But I remember how much of a punk guy was and how just I guess they have that’s the best word I can come up with. I was just a young punk who thought more highly of myself than I should. Because when the judge handed down a sentence, one of the conditions was 90 days house arrest. And And the thing about house arrest many people might not know is you’re not actually confined to your house for 90 consecutive days. You are allowed to leave for predefined time. So if you work outside of the home, you get to leave but you get you get like how you get your basically your commute, and then your commute back and you get nothing else You are not allowed to leave the house otherwise. And he looked at me and he goes, What do you do for a living? And I just looked at him with a smug look. And I just kind of smirked at him and said with such arrogance, I said, Yeah, I work from home. And I remember I remember thinking myself and my attorney looked over at me like you idiot, you know, like, You arrogant idiot. And I remember thinking I’m sure glad he already handed down his sentence because I probably would just get like another year slapped.
Unknown Speaker [26:49]
David Ralph [26:50]
says, so it was a good thing. Looking back, it was a good thing that you didn’t get voted in
Matt McWilliams [26:54]
to thing? Well, absolutely. I mean, you know, this show is all about connecting the dots. And, and I I look back, you know, I grew up playing golf. I was a competitive golf or at one point, my sophomore year, I was ranked 14th in the country in NCAA. And, you know, I went to a lot of tournaments, and that was great. But if I’d never played golf, I never would have met my friend Hunter. He was also a golfer, my dad was this golf instructor. And, you know, fast forward, if I’d never been arrested, I would have settled into a career in politics. I had some great I was working on some other campaigns, you know, consulting them, I was making really good money. And I it was it was what I wanted to do, I thought, but you know, obviously you get arrested for campaign violations. And your name gets dragged through the mud, pretty hard to pick up clients. I did have a couple, including one who’s still in Congress today, who actually kept me on board. You know, he said, Of course, he wasn’t ever gonna lose. He’s been in Congress since I think since pre Civil War days. But, you know, most of my clients dropped me as they should. And it was really hard for me to pick up new one. So if I hadn’t been arrested, I would have stayed in politics. And if I hadn’t have if I’d stayed in politics, I wouldn’t have gone to work for my friend Hunter. And we wouldn’t have started a business together. And if I hadn’t have gone to work for him, I would have never moved back to Nashville. And if I hadn’t been in Nashville and subsequently still been a young punk and been a total jerk, and I never should have been a leader in that company. I would have never been fired by him the first time, which meant I never would have, you know, and I and I start connecting all these dots. And again, it really goes on to after that I went to work for a friend of his who was best friends with a guy named Robert De Smith. And Robert De Smith is the agent for an author named Andy Andrews. So my first day at this company, he hands us and Andy Andrew assigned Andy Andrews book, live instantly I read that book in like a week, become a huge fan of Andy Andrews, faster. Three or four years later, I’m listening to the Andy Andrews podcast in Dallas airport. I’m on the train at Dallas airport. And they have a guy on there named Michael Hyatt. I’m sure you know that name. Too many of you listeners. I never heard of Michael Hyatt. Well, he’s talking about his book platform. I call it my friend Hunter. And I say, dude, you got to get this book. It sounds so good. We just started a book club together. And we just finished our first book. So you got to get this book and we read the book platform. And the book platform is why I started a blog. And subsequently, the book platform is why you and I are even talking today. It’s actually why I got to how I met Marc Seaver crop was because it was through my blog life opinions five,
David Ralph [29:47]
yeah, six times we mentioned him.
Matt McWilliams [29:50]
Oh, boy, he’s getting a big head right now. But that’s why you aren’t even talking or talking today. And it’s why on I mean, literally every day, Monday through Sunday, 365 days a year, I help someone, people I don’t even know, I get an email almost every day saying, and that’s just the ones that I know, I get an email saying, you’ve you’ve made me a better leader. You’ve made me a better husband, better dad a better mom a better whatever better. I got one recently, better grandparent, I’m like, I’ve never written anything about grandparents. But something I’d written had triggered something in her to make her a better better grandmother. And, and it all goes back in a way to me being arrested and getting house arrest when when I connect those dots like that.
David Ralph [30:39]
But I’m going to bring Steve Jobs into the conversation now because this is a speech that he did back in 2005, which really does sort of emphasise the storey that you told us there. But I suppose the million dollar question is, although it was a bad timing your life probably the most terrifying thing I could imagine going. Having a gentleman some post on me. Do you look back on it now and go, actually, dark spot, but it was my light spot that that was the moment where things change for the better, even though at that moment, I couldn’t see it.
Matt McWilliams [31:13]
When I think of all that it led to, you know, I could say that getting married was the best thing that ever happened to me. But I wouldn’t be married if that hadn’t have happened. So when I look back on it, it literally is the best thing that has ever happened in my entire life.
David Ralph [31:29]
And you’re not married to boss Hawk, I just want to know, I don’t know, whatever happened to him. Now, we don’t need to go there. So let’s bring in somebody that has got a powerful personality and has left powerful words on the world. This is Steve Jobs speech.
Steve Jobs [31:46]
Of course, it was impossible to connect the dots looking forward when I was in college. But it was very, very clear looking backwards. 10 years later. Again, you can’t connect the dots looking forward, you can only connect them look looking backwards. So you have to trust that the dots will somehow connect in your future. You have to trust in something, your gut, destiny, life, karma, whatever. Because believing that the dots will connect down the road will give you the confidence to follow your heart, even when it leaves you off the well worn path. And that will make all the difference.
David Ralph [32:22]
What’s your feelings on those words, Matt?
Matt McWilliams [32:25]
Well, it’s funny. I’m reading his biography right now by Walter Isaacson and probably about 50 to 75 pages ago. They quoted that I believe that’s is that from his commencement address at Stanford. Absolutely. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, it sounded like it. I mean, it’s, it’s so true. I mean, obviously, when you look forward, and I say, Okay, here’s where I want to be in 10 years. I believe in the power of visualisation, I believe in I’m a I’m a positive thinker, I believe in that stuff. Because it’s scientifically proven. I mean, they have done countless studies on it. But there’s absolutely no way that you can positively or negatively for that matter project, where you’re going to be in 10 years and outline everything. You know, like you can’t be 10 for 10 on things going, you know, 10 years from now. It’s It’s impossible. There are way too many things that are going to get in or they’re going to happen. There’s people you’re going to meet and I swear this time, I’m not purposely doing it. But take Marc Seaver crop, for example. I didn’t, I didn’t know him two years ago. Now we’re best friends. We met through a blog. So something like that blows me away. When I start connecting those dots. It goes right back to, you know, Michael Hyatt platform, which goes back to Andy Andrews, which goes back to Gabriel Smith, who hired me at Legacy learning systems to run their affiliate programme and gave me Andy Andrews book, which goes back to the hunter, my best friend, which goes back to when me being arrested, which, prior to that I was fired by my dad, if I hadn’t been fired by my dad, well, I still would have been arrested because all that stuff happened before then. But I might have been in a different job had my dad not fired me. And so who knows what that would have done. And so I start looking at all these things. What would I have been as desperate when hunter called me to say can you come start a business with me? Maybe not. If I’d been making $300,000 a year doing what I love when hunter called me, I never I would have would have been an idiot. I would have been like, dude, I’m no go started on your own. I appreciate the offer, though. That Yeah,
David Ralph [34:34]
isn’t it that is the keeping what you’re saying, if you were earning 300,000 pounds a year, or $300,000 a year or whatever, then you would be pretty content, I imagine with your situation. And you are unlikely to break that up and move on. Also, you would think, but I’ve had guests that have been earning six speakers, I had a guest Episode 12 memory called Jason Gaynor, a Canadian chap, and he was earning millions, and realised it didn’t make him happy at all. And so he destroyed his own company, where as I’m sitting here, I kind of think that’s madness. But when you speak to him, you kind of think, yeah, I can totally see why you did fat. So it wasn’t, you know, totally rational that you you turned back on $300,000 over it, certainly how strong you feel at that time when that opportunity arises, isn’t it?
Matt McWilliams [35:33]
Well, absolutely. And that’s why I put the the caveat that if I was making $300,000 a year, rather than I was probably making $15,000 a year at that time, you know, as I just started my own business, if I had been making 300,000 a year and loved what I was doing, I would have told hunter No. But instead I was making $15,000 a year hating my job. So when he came calling it was I thought about two seconds about it. Maybe at the most I said, Yep, I’ll be there as soon as I’m off probation.
And thankfully, they let me off a year early, which is great. But
David Ralph [36:14]
she’s for a while and I’ll be with you.
Matt McWilliams [36:17]
Yeah, exactly. That was that I will say that was an experience though the community service aspect of pic, I literally did nothing but pick up trash for for 40 hours, which was, which was nauseating. That the thing that fascinates
David Ralph [36:32]
me with you is by you seem like your path was always going to be here, you know. And I find that with many of the guests I speak to, I almost think if I’m glad you as a little five year old, well, there’s rules against that. But if I just had a small little one to one with you as a five year old, it’s almost like there’s many versions of you just waiting to find that moment that takes you into sort of the bigger world. I’ve just finished around, I’m still ploughing through it. I’m a liar, really, Barack Obama’s biography dreams of my father. And I’m a quick reader. And I started this last May. And for some reason, I read half a page in bed and don’t have gone. And so I mean, I wake up the next morning, I read that and I’ll read it again. And I keep on going, keep on going, keep going. And the thing that struck me with like, even Barack Obama is my, in my head, mentally, I had a little Barack Obama as a five year old walking around in the little suit in a briefcase, and all that kind of stuff. But he was a chap that was, I think he’s in his 20s now, or he’s about 24 in the storey. And he still has no idea what he wants to do with his life. And he’s drinking and he’s getting stoned. And he he’s, you know, having a sort of normal teenage life. And it’s amazing where that lack of focus or that perceived focus is bad, but it’s just kind of under the surface and it needs something to, to bring it up like it Giza bursting from from the from the ground.
Matt McWilliams [38:05]
Yeah, I mean, I, I totally know what that’s like, because I went, you know, I grew up playing golf, like I mentioned earlier. And so, in high school, and in college, that’s all I thought about, you know, I had, I was smart. In high school, I was good academically, you know, finished, like top 10 in the class of a few hundred. But it came really easy to me, I never had to study and then I get to college, and they actually expect you to attend class, first of all, and they expect you to do additional work outside of class. Well, that was new to me, because I used to just get by doing the bare minimum, and kind of got by on my, on my intellect, so to speak. And, you know, I used to write English papers on books I all I had done was read the introduction to the cliff notes, and I’d make a B. And they would criticise my writing, because they would say there was not enough substantive information, I would always think to myself, just because I didn’t read the books, how much can I get, you know, but I get to college. And you know, I’m there for the golf, and I play golf, and then I, I leave college, and I’d had for the longest time terrible tendinitis in my wrist, that by the time I left college and was playing professionally, it went up to my elbow. Within three months, it was so bad, it had gone up into my neck and the left side of your neck and the rights and your right lower ribs apparently are connected somehow, it had literally gone from my left wrist to my right ribs. And all of this was inflamed to the point where I could not hit golf balls, I could, I could not hit a full shot and not just have searing pain in my body. And they gave me two options. One was surgery that was going to require potentially over a year off, or two was just don’t hit golf balls anymore. Don’t play golf for a long, long time. And I went with the ladder, I quit playing golf. And so now I’m left with like, what do I do, because I I just assumed I was going to be playing professional golf, I assumed I was going to be on the PGA Tour. So I taught golf with my dad, because that’s what you do when you give up playing golf as you teach golf, you know, because it’s easy, and I can, I can impress them by you know, hitting, hitting a few balls here and there. And like, Hey, watch me hit a 325 yard drive dead straight. Now I can charge you $100 an hour, you know, and that’s so that’s what you do. And then when my dad fired me, I’m right back in that, you know, same situation. And so yeah, I don’t I look back on way back, I look back when I was four. And I don’t know how much of this is apocryphal. But my mom says I used to write, you know, that’s what I used to love to do. I used to write I used to make up storeys and, and just write and, and do all these things. And then I always was a skilled writer growing up that was, I never studied it, I didn’t really care about it, but I was good at it. And then when I got into politics, the reason I was so good at political stuff was because I was a great, I could write great fundraising letters. And that’s ultimately what everything comes down to in politics. That’s why people sought me out and paid me a lot of money to help run their campaigns is because I could write fundraising letters. And so I look back on all of that. And I never, of course, imagine, hey, at one day, I’m going to be doing, you know, podcasts sitting on a Bruce guys lap, apparently, but I’m not going to be writing a blog. You know, and I’m going to change people’s lives. And then I have this philosophy, and I’m going to do all these things. I’m going to sell products online, I never in a million years thought that that would happen. And it really, truly did happen in my mind, to the way that I had my life planned out by accident. But when I look back at the skills that I had, and the things that I did, even as a four year old, apparently, apparently it all lined up
David Ralph [41:58]
will be seen. And this is the tagline of the show Join Up Dots connecting our past to build our future. Because I absolutely, when when I started off with that it was it was kind of an idea in my head, I thought I need a tagline. Let’s go with her. And I said to him, my mate, I said, What do you think about you said, Oh, it sounds quite good. Now I’m into the shows, I think Blimey, this is really good because it’s spot on. And all of us, if we go back to our earliest stages are sort of 5678 the things that we could naturally do really well the things when you know, you’re the best drawer in the class, or the best writer or you’re the best dancer, or your best, all those kind of things is naturally the things that we should have focused in on. But we’ve lost somewhere along the line, because we had an opportunity for a job and we just went for it for the money and stuff. And with myself, I look back at my little self. And I think, actually, this is exactly what I should be doing. I know that now, you know, there’s a thing on my about page. I haven’t mentioned it in any shows. And when I was writing my book page, I was thinking about what do I put on here, you know, and I didn’t want it just to be sort of like a linked in CV. So I started sort of writing about, you know, my history, my sort of personal feelings. And I remember the storey that my parents told me that apparently when I was five years old, I was at school. And my teacher said to me, you know, what do you want to be when you grow up baby? And I said, I want to be a jellyfish? And she said, you know, a bit of a bit of a strange answer. And she said to me, do you think you could be a jellyfish and I apparently said, I can be anything I want to be, which is kind of profound. And as I was writing on my about page, I thought I me, you know, now I’m talking to people on a daily basis, who are pretty much a buy into that you can be anything you want to be yes, you need to have passion, or you need to have talent, you need to have skill, you need to have perseverance, you need to have all these elements. But you have got the opportunity at any time of your life to start again. And the situation that you’re in, it’s not a good situation, it doesn’t have to be the situation does it?
Matt McWilliams [44:08]
Well, exactly. I mean, I couldn’t say anything any better than how you just said it, the situation that you are in right now does not have to be the situation. And in fact, it probably won’t be. You know, I think it’s speaking of we’ve mentioned him a couple of times, Andy Andrews, he talks about how I forget exactly how you were words, it but he’s basically says that, at any point in life, you are either coming out of a crisis, about to head into a crisis, or what is it we’re recovering from coming out of a crisis or about to head into a crisis, you know, that’s, those are really the two phases, and you know that there might be a longer period of time between between crises. But, you know, I look at just, if I just look at just the past five years, that’s pretty much been how it is, there’s always something to go through. And we always come out different if I get if I hadn’t been fired. for the fourth time, I’ve only left two companies on my own volition in my entire life, one as a teenager and one as an adult. But if I hadn’t been fired for the fourth time, again, with all that stress of having a newborn and a wife, that’s not working in a brand new home that we’re trying to, you’re naturally you buy a brand new home, you’re spending a lot of money because we moved and we we spent all this money on stuff to decorate and all that. If I hadn’t have gone through that, I know I wouldn’t be doing what I’m doing right now I would, I would have been content where I was. And it’s not about the money, it all, but I know I wouldn’t be enjoying it. And I know for a fact I wouldn’t be making four times five times more than I’ve ever made in my entire life. So I, you know, you can’t, you’re not going to be stronger. I know, it’s so cliche, but you’re just absolutely not going to be stronger if you don’t go through through those struggles.
David Ralph [46:10]
I was talking to a chap just before you and I batch interviews, I do loads and loads and loads of them over a couple of days. And he was talking about the Steve Jobs speech. And a lot of the time people will say yes, it’s spot on. I have had a couple of guests that have said I want to punch him in the face for saying that. And but they’ve been come out with quite an eloquent, you know, answer to why they want to do that. And he actually said, the thing about that speech that really strikes a chord with him is that all of us nowadays with the economy being like it is, without the job, the life security that we might have had when it was 3040 years ago. Those words, say hope. And it’s as simple as that. It gives you hope. But by having faith, by having trust in yourself, and by taking action. But your life can start again, whenever you want it to be what you think
Matt McWilliams [47:06]
I could not another thing I could not possibly agree more with, you know, we mentioned, you said with the economy being like it is today. And the thing is we’ve been moving naturally been moving towards this economy for the past, you know, 50 4050 years, and we’ve been moving more and more towards when when telephones became, you know, when everybody had a telephone suddenly became a little bit easier for some people to do their sales work from home, for example. And suddenly, a dentist appointment at three o’clock in the afternoon didn’t mean that you stopped working. And then cell phones came along. And suddenly you could be driving and still communicate with people are sitting on the subway, whatever it is, and still communicate with people. So the economy has been moving to this. Every year, it just gets closer and closer to obviously where we are today. And when I think about that, when I think about what the economy, quote unquote, has done to, to me, it’s forced me to get out of that mindset of I’m just going to work for somebody. For the rest of my life, I’ve got to be an employee or, or I’ve got to be an entrepreneur, but it’s got to be an entrepreneur with an office and, you know, 17.2 employees that report to me each day, and we’re all meeting face to face, it’s completely changed the way I see that stuff. And the word hope is a great word. Because when I was asked by a school teacher, you know, somebody who’s in that traditional world, the world that really quite frankly, hasn’t evolved in the past 250 years, in terms of how they run education, it’s still based on tenure and things like that here in the United States. I was at, you know, what about the risk when you started your own business. And I thought about it for about two seconds. And I said, honestly, it was the least risky thing I’ve ever done in my entire life. Because for up until that point, other than when I had my own business for a period of time, and it was struggling. Up until that point, I always worked for one company. And each of those companies that I’d worked for, you know, something went wrong. And technically it was sometimes it was my fault. And sometimes it wasn’t one company got investigated by the FTC, and had to pay a ridiculous fine, and had to stop doing some stuff and had to pay people less. Another company had one of the people in the company, one of the partners, that company embezzled money. And so when I look back on those companies, when I worked for other people, I had all my eggs in one basket. And I was completely different dependent upon somebody at the top of that company not screwing up so badly that it was going to put me out of work the next day, or in the case of being fired one of the times it was fired because they got really bad information and bad advice. And the other three, I totally deserved that each and every time when my dad fired me, he should have fired me six months before, but that’s a different storey. But the last time I really wasn’t the right thing for the company to do. And they struggled mightily after I left. I was always dependent upon those companies, I had one stream of income that was the company that worked that I worked for. Now as an entrepreneur, I have multiple streams of income. And so if if one of my clients tomorrow said, Hey, Matt, we just don’t want to work with you anymore, I would be heartbroken. But my family’s still going to be fine financially. And I’ll go get another client pretty quickly. I’ve got a backlog of potential clients, if something dried up, and you know, such and such didn’t make me as much money tomorrow, I’m fine. Because I’ve got so many streams of income coming in that. Like I said, it’s the the least risky thing I’ve ever done in my life.
David Ralph [51:02]
I want the audience to know that if you’re in a job and you love your job, then just go I say this a lot. But just go in there and do it better than you’ve ever done before you know exactly. But if you not in a job that you like doing, I’m not saying you know, start a brick and mortar, I’m just saying, start looking around and start having, you know, conversations with people and send out a couple of emails and ask how somebody got going if it’s something that you fancy doing. Because more often than not, you’re going to get a positive answer. And we say that the G on every show, the most scary thing about starting and changing your situation is the starting. And once you actually get that momentum and you start moving forward, and you’ve sent a few emails out and you bought your URL, and you’ve made your colours look as nice as possible. And the fact that before you become, quote unquote successful, no one gives a monkey’s what your website, look, are you URL or anything because no one’s looking, just get out there and sort of play around and make Connexions because suddenly you will think to yourself, ah, I’m actually building something I’m not playing around. And once you get there, and if it’s linked to your passion and the things that you do well, I your you unique, Paul, Bain, you really are nailing down security.
Matt McWilliams [52:24]
And the other thing is if you currently do love your job, and at the time I started my consulting business, I loved my job. I ate, slept and breathed My, my, my job at that time. I love the company, I loved everything we were doing. But I still knew I needed to have something on the side. And so I started that side business. And I didn’t try to grow it. I just took a few clients here and there. And I was making $25,000 a year maybe doing that. But it gave me gave me that business in place so that when I did lose my job, I could just take off from there, it’s a lot easier to go from 25 to 50, than it is to go from zero to 25 significantly easier. And so I always tell people, you know the old saying, When life hands you lemons make lemonade. I tell people when life hands you lemons have a lemonade stand already open. You know, you don’t need to be selling a lot of it. But don’t don’t make lemonade in reaction to, to being handed lemons, you have a lemonade stand open, in general, already making some lemonade, these are additional lemons. And now you just go great. Now all I gotta do is make more lemonade. So if you’re working five hours a week on the side, making, even if it’s just a few thousand dollars, that’s all you’re making, you’re making five hours a week on the side and making the same hourly rate as you do at work or even less to start with. When suddenly if that job does go away, or you just decide that you like this more than you’ve got it in place, and you can you can start rocking from there
David Ralph [54:00]
is affiliate marketing this that’s a whole different subject. But is that the way to go for people who are looking at getting a little bit extra into their, into their salary each month?
Matt McWilliams [54:12]
You know, this will sound odd coming from somebody who, you know, runs affiliate programmes and, you know, and trains people on how to set up affiliate programmes and really believes that every company should have an affiliate programme. And I do believe that I’m not suggesting that’s not true. So this might seem odd, but yes, and no, it it’s a, it’s a piece of the pie, it’s a it’s a part of the formula, I don’t, I don’t personally suggest that people go out and try to make, let’s just say, you know, take the average American, for example, I believe the average American family makes around somewhere around $48,000 a year. So if you’re looking to go make $2,000 a month, that’s that’s life changing. For some that’s a 50% increase in income, that’s life changing for the average family of four in America. I don’t know what the equivalent would be in, in pounds. But anyhow, you know, if that’s the case, I don’t suggest that you say I’m going to go out and make $2,000 a month just on affiliate income. If you’re if you’re blogging, if you’re podcasting or whatever, you’re certainly when you when you reference a book, use an Amazon link and make a few bucks. If you’re gonna, if you’re going to promote other people’s products, reference a reference and affiliate link, you might make a few hundred dollars or even a couple thousand dollars. But I really suggest thinking of it still as more of a business in the sense of, you need to have your own book, you need to have your own products, you need to have your own ways for people to give you money directly, not through through other company. So it can be a piece of it, I don’t know exactly what the formula is maybe, you know, I would probably target somewhere around 50% or less of your of your income should be affiliate income. And then as you grow, that percentage will become less and less and less. I know, mentioned him earlier, Michael Hyatt he’s talked about this when he first got into the you know, into blogging, almost all of his income was affiliate income. Now it’s probably a quarter of 1% is affiliate income. So yeah, it’s a part of it. But certainly don’t not a it’s not a viable place to build your business. Because again, even though you may have multiple companies, all of your eggs are in the affiliate basket. And as we’ve proven over the past few years, there has been legislation in the United States, that has made it harder and harder for affiliates to earn income. And I’ve heard many storeys of affiliates who were earning, you know, say $100,000 a year just through affiliates that are there, their income has been cut by 67%. They’re down under $40,000 a year. So I don’t recommend putting all of your eggs in the affiliate basket.
David Ralph [56:49]
And I think monk save a club would agree.
Matt McWilliams [56:53]
I absolutely think that Marc Seaver crop would agree, I’m going
David Ralph [56:56]
to try to get to double figures by the end of the show, I’ll promise you. Just before we let you go, this is the very end part of the show, Matt, and this is what we call the Sermon on the mic and is when we send you back in time to have a one on one with your younger self. And if you did walk into a room and you saw the young Matt being there, would you want to talk to the five year old Matt, the entrepreneurial five year old man, the matter in handcuffs, the mat on the golf course? What type of man would you choose, so I’m going to play the music and what he paid. So you’re up, this is the Sermon on the mic
with the best of the show.
Matt McWilliams [57:55]
Alright, so to my, to my five year old self, I would say there’s going to be a day when when you are, you’re suddenly faced with being a leader. And you’re going to wake up, you’re going to start a company maybe or you’re going to be in a position and it’s going to, you’re going to go from practically no employees to having 15 or 20 people to report directly to you or you’re going to have 50 people in the company some of whom you don’t even know. And you’re going to have to say no to being a leader because Don’t, don’t watch Wall Street, the movie Wall Street and think that that’s a leader, don’t watch bobby knight and think that that’s a leader don’t learn your leadership lessons from the wrong people. To spend a lot of time as you’re younger before you ever even have the opportunity to be a leader and learn everything you can about leadership with the first time you get it to be a leader say no. Because you’re going to need to spend more time following people, you’re going to need to spend more time learning from good leaders and not. And not being a punk. Not thinking that the corner office is is a status symbol. That would be some, I would definitely tell you do not think that you’ve made it just because you have corner office with the corner office with a nice view. And don’t think that you’ve made it because you know, you’ve got people who report to you. You can change the world, you can have an impact on people’s lives. Don’t ever lose the feeling that you’re not necessarily better than anyone and that you’re more powerful than people just because they work under you.
David Ralph [59:54]
That’d be what I told myself, who would you say Matt is a leader that really, he’s a beacon to you now at your age?
Matt McWilliams [1:00:05]
You know, sadly, I don’t I don’t have that many. Again, I it’s actually an area where I failed. And I everything I just said, you know, when I think about what I would tell myself as a as a five year old comes because I’ve been in that position where I woke up one day went, wait a minute, there’s like 20 people that report to me, and I really suck at this. And so I would have I wasn’t prepared to be a leader. And if I could go back in time, I would have demanded when they when my business partner said, okay, you’re going to lead this department over like, no, you’re gonna have to hire somebody. I’ll continue to work here, and I’ll learn from somebody. But if I had to look at somebody that I that I know from experience, you know, not just somebody I’ve read, you know, somebody feel can say jack welch, but most people haven’t worked for jack welch. You know, most people haven’t worked for Steve Jobs. Most people haven’t worked for a warren buffett. So I really try to focus on people I have personal experience with and that would be name’s Gabriel Smith, I think I mentioned him earlier. And he’s the founder and CEO of a company called legacy learning systems. And I’ve, you know, he, he made mistakes. And he went through a very stressful time in his company, as I mentioned earlier with the FTC.
David Ralph [1:01:17]
Matt McWilliams [1:01:18]
he’s a leader that I look up to, in many respects, because he’s the complete antithesis of me. He’s, he’s much calmer, he’s not as tightly wound. And he tends to think through decisions for more than two seconds. And he’s very careful about what comes out of his mouth. And if you’re familiar with the disc profile, you know, the DI CS, I’m, I’m all D and I, and I’m the ready fire aim, type person, and he’s more of the Ready, aim, aim, aim, type. And, and I think if you could, if you can get somebody who’s kind of in the middle there, that would be would be somebody that would work really well. And so that may be one of his faults is the it will think through things too much. But his he had a quote once, and I’m sure thousands of others have said it, but he looked at me when I came running into his office with my 71st idea of the week. And he just looked at me said, Matt, can you let that one Bake for a little while and, and I did I let it bake for long, it turned out to be an absolutely stupid idea that had I been in charge we would have tried to execute and I don’t know, we would have wasted 10s of thousands of dollars. And instead I you know, he made me Be patient. I mean, it was eating me up inside when he said let it bake for little I’m like, but this is really good. We got if we don’t do this tomorrow, this is gonna be the end of the company, you know, and rarely, rarely are there things like that, where if you don’t act immediately, it’s a lost opportunity. Most opportunities will still be there tomorrow, and the next day and the next day. And for people like me the Heidi’s the ready fire aim type. I think we could do well. To to realise that into two, you know, the old adage is sleep on it. And I if I just sleep on something, I’ve reduced my bad decisions by 90% just by sleeping on it even though it drives me nuts.
David Ralph [1:03:16]
I’m writing that down most opportunities will be there the next day. I like that I like that very much.
Matt McWilliams [1:03:22]
And that’s and to clarify, that’s not to say you just you know miss opportunities you just be lazy and you procrastinate for months. I’m talking 24 to 48 hours you know again sleep on it make the decision the following morning. If it’s a Vinny you know it’s not about like what to you know, what shirt Am I going to wear? That’s then you can make that pretty quick. But most decisions if you’re like me if you struggle with that this is it for somebody who’s already struggling with procrastination or, or indecision. Don’t listen to anything I’m saying if you’re indecisive, just ignore everything I’ve just said. But if you’re the the quick thinking type, you could do well to on the big decisions, sleep on it for one or two nights.
David Ralph [1:04:04]
When I quit my job, I’m going to say goodbye to you in a moment. But when I quit my job, it was within 15 seconds of having a conversation. I walked from one desk to another sat down and mentally I’d quit. And it was instant. And it was so strong and so powerful. I couldn’t change my mind even though I was terrified beyond anything that I’ve ever done because I’d taken all the income that I was earning and just gave it back to my employer. But it was it was 15 seconds.
Matt McWilliams [1:04:39]
Yeah, I think that storey is very similar to Marc Seaver crops in a way.
David Ralph [1:04:44]
Marc Seaver crop is a legend. And I’m going to put pictures on my website og Marc Seaver crop in different sort of varying states of undress. Now that’s getting a bit we’re getting very good with how can we connect with you, Matt? Matt Williams.
Matt McWilliams [1:05:00]
Yeah, well go to Matt McWilliams. com. That’s the easiest way or search my name on iTunes. Because it depending upon when this comes out, if you search Matt McWilliams on iTunes, you’ll find you’ll find my podcast on there. And if you don’t find my podcast, if it’s not out yet, you’ll find interviews with with me and other podcasters like yourself, and like Marc Seaver crop.
David Ralph [1:05:23]
You’ve got to do the podcast, you’ve got a voice for it. You really have. I’m like everybody, though. I hate the sound of my own voice. Yeah, but this is the weird thing, isn’t it? Because you are the only person who hears your voice the way you do everybody else. If you stir suddenly could put it out the way that you hear it, everyone would go always sounds strange, yc sound like that.
Unknown Speaker [1:05:45]
Very, very, very, very true.
David Ralph [1:05:47]
My so thank you so much, sir, for spending time with us today joining those dots. It’s been an absolute pleasure. It really has. Please come back again, when you have more dots to join up. Because that’s the beauty of this show. Our histories keep on growing forward. And you will always have more dot to connect up. Because I believe as I’ve been saying all the way through, but the only way to build our futures is by connecting our past Mr. Matt, Matt Williams, thank you so much.
Matt McWilliams [1:06:11]
Absolutely, David, thank you.
David doesn’t want you to become a faded version of the brilliant self you are wants to become so he’s put together an amazing guide for you called the eight pieces of advice that every successful entrepreneur practices, including the two that changed his life. Head over to Join Up Dots.com to download this amazing guide for free and we’ll see you tomorrow on Join Up Dots.