Shift Financial Founder Spencer Sheinin Joins Us On The Steve Jobs Inspired Join Up Dots Podcast
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Introducing Shift Financial Founder Spencer Sheinin
Shift Financial founder Spencer Sheinin is our guest today joining us on the Steve Jobs inspired Join Up Dots podcast.
He is a man who is taking the stress, pain and quite frankly annoyance out of one of the worst things about being in biz.
Yeah we all know that part of the year when we start getting letters through asking for the paperwork that you can’t find.
And then it asks “how much did you earn last year, and you realise you have to work out the expenses to then take it away from the income”…nightmare.
As he says “If you’re like most entrepreneurs, you probably hate accounting.
The information your bookkeepers and accountants bring isn’t at all understandable or helpful, and you know you’re not getting the information you need to run your business.
You’re stressed, fed up, and even embarrassed about the state of your books.
But you don’t know how to make things better.
One thing is certain: you can’t afford to spend time learning accounting—nor would you want to.
How The Dots Joined Up For Spencer Sheinin
As founder and CEO of Shift Financial Insights, his company provides ridiculously simple accounting and insights for businesses on the rise.
Spencer loves sharing his knowledge as an instructor at the Chartered Professional Accountants of British Columbia (CPABC) and has spoken all over North America about why entrepreneurs shouldn’t fear their books.
To be honest this is a man that looks like he doesn’t fear anything as when he isn’t knee deep in ledgers and spreadsheets, he is also an endurance sports enthusiast and has completed several ultra-marathons, IRON-MAN triathlons, and marathon swims.
So when did he start to realise that instead of working for a major corporation it was time to go out on his own?
And why do people struggle so much to keep things organised when running their online ventures?
Well let’s find out as we bring onto the show to start joining up dots with the one and only Spencer Sheinin
During the show we discussed such deep subjects with Spencer Sheinin such as:
Why Spencer always gives the advice of outsourcing your accountancy issues as soon as possible when starting out in business.
Why we should view having an accountant as going to the right Doctor for the right specialist advice. Choose the expert you need for the right task.
Spencer reveals his “Why” for his business, and man has he knocked this out of the park on this one. Spine tingling stuff.
Spence gives us a list of the big questions that we must all ask our accountants to make sure we get the gem.
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Full Transcription Of Shift Financial Spencer Sheinin Interview
When we’re young, we have an amazing positive outlook about how great life is going to be. But somewhere along the line we forget to dream and end up settling. Join Up Dots features amazing people who refuse to give up and chose to go after their dreams. This is your blueprint for greatness. So here’s your host live from the back of his garden in the UK. David Ralph.
David Ralph [0:25]
Yes, hello there. Good morning, everybody. Good morning and welcome to Join Up Dots. Thank you so much for being here. Now through Join Up Dots. We bring you many different conversations, some about SEO, some about website design. Some of it is about the sexy stuff and sometimes the dark side of entrepreneurship. Today’s kind of falls into the dark side in my view, because our guest today joining us on the Steve Jobs inspired Join Up Dots podcast, as I like to call it gets me good SEO on that one. He is a man who is taking the stress pain and quite frankly, annoyance One of the worst things about being in Bisbee yourself. Yeah, we all know that part of the year when we start getting letters through asking for the paperwork, right? Yeah, can’t find and then he asked how much did you earn last year and you realise you have to work out the expenses to then take it away from the income before you quote it. So nightmare. Now as he says, if you’re like most entrepreneurs, you probably hate accounting, the information your bookkeepers and accountants bring isn’t at all understandable or helpful. And you know, you’re not getting the information you need to run your business. you’re stressed, fed up and even embarrassed about the state of your books, but you don’t know how to make things better. One thing is certain you can’t afford to spend time learning accounting, nor would you want to now, he has created shift to financial insights and he’s company provides ridiculously simple accounting and insights for businesses on the rise, as he says sharing his knowledge as an instructor of the Chartered professional accountants of British Columbia. He has taken that knowledge and has spoken all over In North America about why entrepreneurs shouldn’t be their books. And to be honest, this is a man that looks like he doesn’t hear anything at all as when he isn’t knee deep in Legends and spreadsheets. He’s also an endurance sports enthusiast and has completed several ultra marathons, Ironman triathlons and marathons swims. Let’s get to business. When did he start to realise that instead of working for a major corporation, like Price Waterhouse, it was time to go out on his own and why do people struggle so much to keep things organised when running their online ventures? Well, let’s find out as we bring onto the show to start Join Up Dots with the one and only Mr. Spencer Sheinin. Morning Spencer, how are you?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [2:43]
Wow, excellent. Thank you What, uh, what is it? That might have been the most enthusiastic introduction? So thank you, David. That was That was amazing. I appreciate it.
David Ralph [2:51]
It’s hard to get enthusiastic about accountancy, isn’t it? so well. Let’s give me a round of applause. There we go.
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [2:59]
Now I love it,
David Ralph [3:00]
we’re gonna get straight into this because this is something that when I started back in 2014, officially with a business, I thought to myself, this is going to be easy. This is going to be easy. I just basically do double entry bookkeeping, a bit of this on one side a bit a bit on the other side. And then in the first year, I thought to myself, I need an accountant. I need an accountant to keep track track of all this. And then I got rid of that accountant because I didn’t like him. And I went with another one and I’ve had about three Now, what is this simple route for somebody starting off listening to this podcast and thinking, I want to start the right way? Is it to get an accountant or is it just to be very organised?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [3:46]
Yeah, great question. I mean, I’ll just start by resonating when I got into business, it was in 2000. And like you I thought everything was gonna be easy. And the part of the problem with accounting is it’s only one of the things you have to get right have a whole tonne of Things to make the business successful. And so I already had the accounting part done because I’m a CPA. But in terms of actually the entire business, I had my versions of accounting. So like, I know exactly how painful that is, and going through several iterations of people. So in terms of your question, my take on it is, there’s different steps along the way, obviously, to be successful, but I would get rid of accounting as soon as possible off of your plate. Number one, because most entrepreneurs hate it, there’s something that that you love that that you’re passionate about, you have a technical skill on that you think you can do somebody better than somebody else, or anybody else, and you go out and start it. And you can either spend your time building that amazing business product service, online solution, whatever it is, or you can be doing accounting, you can’t be doing both at the same time. So for me, the sooner you get it off the plate off your plate, the better and then of course becomes the question of how do we make Make sure it’s good. And we don’t end up with three bookkeepers along the way which is kind of a, that’s really a separate conversation.
David Ralph [5:06]
I remember listening to an interview with Billy Joe. And he always says, My biggest advice about accountants is get to, one to look on your books and one to look after the accountant as looking at your books. Now, that’s a kind of shady kind of view on it. But if there is a viewpoint isn’t there, but nowadays, when everything’s online, and everything sort of whizzing around, I know with myself every month, I have to sit there and think like what I buy paid out for, where’s the invoices, let’s group them together. But it is something that can quite easily go unseen. And you can lose money, you can transfer things into the wrong place. Did you agree with Billy’s point of view, or is that kind of a jaded old musician’s point of view?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [5:53]
Well, I’m gonna offer a slight variation with respect of course to Billy Joel. In that, you know, when we use the word accountant, we kind of throw it as one thing but almost think of it like Doctor, there’s so many different areas of specialty in so many different disciplines within accounting, that it almost doesn’t matter which accountant you have doing it and which account you have watching the accountant, if you don’t have the right skill set in both of those, that kind of doesn’t matter. And, and really one of the huge problems smaller businesses have and entrepreneurs in particular have that I see over and over is really having the wrong person in the wrong seat or that or, or more importantly expecting the wrong thing. And let me let me just offer one frame because I think it’ll help explain it is there’s two kind of underlying areas. For an entrepreneur one, there’s just what I would call the hygiene of accounting. This is the day to day stuff that you hate. It’s the it’s all the stuff that you’ve already mentioned, the invoicing, the the expenses, the p&l, all that stuff. That’s the basic stuff that we all have to do. That’s when the government comes knocking at the door, looking for receipts, all of that has to be done and it has to be done right? The other day, and I think why it’s such a pain for accountants or for entrepreneurs. And and we don’t even know it’s a pain because we haven’t experienced what good looks like it’s kind of one of those if you’ve never flown in first class, yeah, you’re kind of happy with the back of the plane, and then you have one experience in first class. Then you go back to the back, you’re like, what am I doing here? I do. I you know, I occasionally get to fly business when I travel for business just for the record, not all the time. But it’s the actual financial insights of the business, the stories that are buried in the numbers where there is so much power in terms of like, Oh, this part of the business is making money. This part of the business is losing money. So it’s not just about Am I making or losing money? Overall, it’s it’s those little finer points within it. That’s like you’re spending all of your time on this. And guess what you’re not doing You can grow that 1000 times it still won’t be profitable. But this little tiny thing that you didn’t even think was part of your business, if you can grow that, and then it informs the marketing and informs the, you know, whatever else you’re doing around to grow your business, doing it the right way based on that sound financial information. That’s the difference between first class in the back of the plane, most people are flying in the back of the plane, and most of them have IMAX and earplugs in.
David Ralph [8:29]
Well, I don’t understand Spencer, maybe you can clarify for North America, but certainly over here. I don’t think of an accountant as an expense because the next year I claim it back as an expense. And so it’s basically free anyway. Would that be the case in North America? Is it something that you always one year before getting it back from the government anyway?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [8:53]
Yes or no. I mean, it doesn’t make it free because you still have to pay it and you’re just getting the net savings on the tax. It’s not like you don’t get a full rebate for your accountant. So I don’t I consider it an expense. It’s not free. And we have to obviously, keep an eye on our expenses. But yeah, so we like so it’s not I mean, this year is delayed a little bit for for pandemic related reasons. But taxes are typically done due for months after year end, and then you pay the difference. But in but in North America, at least in Canada, when you’re if you have a really good year next year, they actually take instalment taxes along the way. So you’re kind of chipping away at your taxes during the year and then just doing a true up at the end. So there there often is a delay, especially if a growing business or you’re making more and more money each year, but I definitely still think of it as as an expense for sure.
David Ralph [9:46]
So big question, and maybe it’s not one that you can answer but how does somebody in in that scenario, but you said and I thought it’s brilliant because I hadn’t thought about it, thinking of an accountant is going to the right doctor. And I must admit I’ve got a wonderful accountant now he’s a he’s a family friend. And I trust him with my life. Basically, I don’t trust him with my wife I do my life. And with that, how do people find that they’ve got the right one? Is it just trial and error? Do you have to go through to a phrase like speed dating? Is there a kind of trusted trader for accountants where you can see reviews and stuff?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [10:27]
Yes to two things on that one, just to I want to speak a little bit more about that the type of accountant and in fact, even better than a doctor analogy is imagine building a house like a custom home, you bought land and you’re excited about your home. You know, in most sites, let’s assume it’s a flat we’ll call it in most places, depending on how big it is and whatnot. Most construction sites at least over here, you’re gonna have your general contractor, the person in charge of the job site, you’re then going to have some sub trades, you got your plumbers or electricians, your carpenters and then you If a big job you might even have a couple labourers, you know, they’re carrying the bags of cement and, and digging ditches that type of thing. And so if you think about an accounting department, along those same lines, you know, the labour at the bottom, that’s the bookkeeper. Same thing handling all the transactions, the sub trades, those are kind of more skilled technical people maybe have gone to school for a period of time. That’s what you know, at least over here. And I’m pretty sure you call it the same as controller, maybe assistant controller, and they’re responsible for things like the reporting, the really, really fun things that everybody loves, like accounting, standard operating procedures, but also things like picking the software overseeing the bookkeeper making sure you know making sure things are flowing properly structured properly, and then at the top is like the director of finance and CFO. And those are really there for their strategic look at the look at things. You know what’s happening in five years. Do we have enough money? Now of course, I’m talking about fairly good sized business has to have all of those levels. What happens for a lot of entrepreneurs and startup mode and in growth mode? They go with a bookkeeper doing everything. Well now go back to the house analogy that’s kind of like wanting to build a house and hiring a labour to do everything. That’s not a knock on labourers or buck bookkeepers. I’ve seen some great bookkeepers that are some amazing labourers. They’re part of the process, but they’re not the whole solution. So for so when I was talking about the doctor issues, so that’s what happens a lot of entrepreneurs are basically hiring a labour to build them entire house. So that’s sort of problem one, and that we can’t actually afford the whole stack as an entrepreneur, right. I mean, accountants aren’t the cheapest so so now you’re so a, you’re stuck with just a bookkeeper doing everything and you’re saying, you know, help me understand my numbers, but that’s not what they’re to do. The bookkeepers are really there to handle the transactions of the business. So that’s kind of Problem one. And then problem two is quality. And I mean, if if you want to take a moment, I can offer a few questions. These are really kind of basic questions. If they’re not going to be like the, you know, yes, this is a absolute certainty, but you can weed out some people pretty quickly. Well, even if you don’t understand accounting, just by seeing how they react, you go,
David Ralph [13:24]
Well, you know, because I can just sit here and bask in your glory.
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [13:30]
do my best. It’s actually more helpful if if they’re already doing your books, and you’re not sure if they’re good enough where you’re listening to this go like, oh man is my bookkeeper suck. I would start by asking a few very simple questions. You know, show me the latest bank reconciliation, whether they’re using the latest and greatest on online cloud based accounting solution, or they’re still doing it on a desktop or they’re doing it on a ledger, whatever it is, they should be able to show you. You know, within a week or two of the of each month last month’s bank reconciliation, even if you don’t know what one looks like, ask the question. And if they look at you confused, or they look at you embarrassed, you know, that’s a bad sign. So really, they that’s kind of a quick test to see, are they keeping up with the absolute most basic things? It sounds really, really entry level. But I’ll tell you like in my business, we handle the books for a lot of clients. When we get in, I’ve seen somebody with no reconciliations for two years. So that’s just a quick test if they’re more than one or two weeks away from having one red flag, don’t get me just
David Ralph [14:36]
ask the question on that Spencer. Sure. How did I get away with it then if I haven’t done that for two years?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [14:44]
because nobody’s asked them.
David Ralph [14:46]
I know, Sony they got a report and stuff that’s part of the bigger collating process, isn’t it?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [14:53]
I mean, your your question is amazing. And the number of times we asked the exact thing you’re Asking, when we take on a new client that doesn’t have one for two years, we say, how is it possible that they haven’t had this for two years? So I get it like, I mean, you’re right. And what it typically means is the entrepreneur, the only thing they’re running their business with is their bank account. They’re not running it with any kind of reporting whatsoever. And they’re probably behind in their taxes.
David Ralph [15:24]
Well, they’re probably behind and they’re probably spending dam site more because they’re not looking at the ins and outs.
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [15:31]
Well, and worse than that is, you know, your bank account at any moment in time. Like, if you just get a big deposit from someone and you get all excited about it, but you haven’t paid or like you say all the expenses related to it. Like that’s just a point in time. It’s not a reflection of how you’re doing it can be it can be abnormally high because of some event and it can be abnormally low because of some event and you’re all sad. It’s like Well, no, you actually have a big cheque coming tomorrow, so be happy about it. So yeah, the bank account itself. I mean, while it’s something to look at, it is not the thing to look out for sure. What
David Ralph [16:06]
we’re going to pay some motivational words. We’re going to take you away from this, but I want you to remember where you were Spencer. He’s Jim Carrey.
Jim Carrey [16:13]
My father could have been a great comedian, but he didn’t believe that that was possible for him. And so he made a conservative choice. Instead, he got a safe job as an accountant. And when I was 12 years old, he was let go from that safe job. And our family had to do whatever we could to survive. I learned many great lessons from my father, not the least of which was that you can fail at what you don’t want. So you might as well take a chance on doing
David Ralph [16:38]
what you love. I want to ask you some questions now, but we’re going to come back to where you were. So I hope your brain stays in focus of finding median. So what is it as Jim Carrey says, you might as well find what you love. And is this what you love because I can’t stand it. And if that’s the case, what Do you love about it? Why Why is this your business?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [17:03]
You got me excited for a couple of reasons. First of all, I love Jim Carrey, not just as a comedian and actor, but if you actually kind of, and it’s the interview you took is a really good one. I’ve actually heard that one before. He’s got a lot of insights very spiritual guy. So if you if you don’t like the will, you may struggle, but he’s super interesting to me. And so the idea of passion. So first of all, I hate accounting. I put out a book earlier this year and and in the introduction, the first words of the book, or I drove to work nauseous every day. And I did, I literally hated accounting, and I left it for a long time. So I actually think of myself as an entrepreneur first. And then I think of other things as like a runner, outdoors enthusiast and somewhere down the list as accountant. So I actually really hate accounting and people who know me from my accounting schooling days, if they saw me now and it’s like, what do you do I have an accounting practice they’d literally fall over So it makes the question even more relevant. But what I can tell you is so my why, hopefully familiar with Simon Sinek start with why my Why is I believe entrepreneurs can change the world. And my role is to help them through their financial blind spot. So that actually gets me excited. I’ve worked with entrepreneurs kind of forever, I’ve coached I’ve mentored, I’ve been part of the entrepreneurs organisation for 15 years, I meet with I just, I’m all about the entrepreneur. So this allows me and my business to work with and support entrepreneurs, get them through their financial blind spots, so they can change the world. And, honestly, David, I don’t, I don’t actually do any accounting anymore. I’m not allowed the accountant that does the books for my business. There’s a joke between us. She’s worked with me for over 10 years. And it’s like, you’re not allowed in the system. So my thing is, we put in a team. Yeah, no, I’m not allowed to touch it. We put in a team That actually really does it there is a there’s actually a personality profile that is perfectly suited for accounting for accountancy. And we actually test for that during interviewing, we bring on people that love the discipline that love the following the rules that love the order, there are people that are inspired to do that. And then what I get to do is more of the insights piece that I talked about earlier, kind of the CFO stuff, where it’s like, how do I make now take good hygiene and pull out the story, the real meat that can actually change people’s lives, not just the entrepreneur who can have a bigger impact, but you know, entrepreneurs, then you get bigger you have more and more employees, you’re impacting the community then you talked about Steve Jobs earlier and and how you can have impact in your world, even if it’s a small community or you’re going to change the world in the future, whatever it is, you’ve got to get unlocked into so that’s what I get excited about it, that the numbers tell a story and it’s like wow, like it can be game changing when you look at your business. Through a financial lens with clarity and simplicity that gets me super excited. I love doing that. I love it when people light up because we found something that changed their world. That is
David Ralph [20:12]
one of the best ways so many people quote Simon Sinek and and most of the people when I say my why it doesn’t excite me at the same time. And but you said your WHY? And it links it to helping people move through and gain financial clarity it I thought to myself, I totally understand this. I totally understand this, which leads us is a perfect segue to the book that you wrote entrepreneur numbers or entrepreneur numbers, the surprisingly simple path to financial clarity which you can get on Amazon and all good book shops. So with this, what is the angle with this again, it’s not teaching them financial accountancy rules. It’s teaching them how to look at their business in a different way to gain clarity, is it?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [21:02]
Yeah, exactly. So kind of everything I do, whether it’s the book or you know, I fortunate that I speak on this a fair amount to entrepreneur groups. And I never want to teach accounting, I don’t want to be in and I also don’t want to teach but you know, financial accounting for non financial people like that’s not the idea. Really what this is, is about empowering the entrepreneur, to of course, get the information they need when they need it, but most importantly, in a format that works for entrepreneurs, intuitive, simple, quick. So the problem i think that you know, the paradigm we’ve been in is accountants do their thing. And entrepreneurs have to come to the accountant side, learn how to read financial statements, which are technical documents, I went to school for years to learn how to write, create, interpret financial statements, most entrepreneurs didn’t. So for some reason, accountants go hear your financials and then run the other direction. What entrepreneur is intending to is intends to do is to actually flip that paradigm and be actually entrepreneurs, here’s how to tell your accountants to get you information in a completely different way. You know, you can actually in literally and I mean, this sounds like a, you know, an infomercial, but you can in five to 10 minutes or less every month, have more clarity and understanding on your financial information without ever looking at your financial statements than you could possibly imagine. You could have, like, it’s game changing when somebody sits in first class from a financial position, then the back of the plane and I mean in terms of understanding, so my my aim is to get people from like us rating of two or three with their comfort over their information to a nine or 10 without them having to do the work just by holding their accountants accountable to doing it in a different way. With lots of samples, examples, you know, charts, graphs, pictures, you know, a picture’s worth 1000 words. So it’s it’s a guide to helping people empower themselves over this area, not learning how to do it the way it’s done today. Totally different approach.
David Ralph [23:14]
I know so many times you go to a doctor, and you sit there and you talk to them, and you come back out and you think, I don’t know if they’ve helped me better. I’ve just gone in and chatted about something for 10 minutes. So with this, you’re going to be able to go in there with almost a kind of mental checklist of saying to your accountant, I want to see this. I want to see bat, I want to see whatever. Now. I totally understand that. Well, the accountants get annoyed because you’re kind of pushing them where they many clients wouldn’t do that, or would this be acceptable behaviour?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [23:50]
Would you go to a doctor that you didn’t get satisfactory support from?
David Ralph [23:54]
I’ve been going for about 40 years me every time I go, which is when I don’t go to the doctors anymore. I never Nobody knows me. Oh, no.
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [24:02]
There you go, you know, I So, I mean, I guess I don’t care. There’s a lot of accounts out there and, and actually, in fact entrepreneurs like I would say have the accountant read it too. And now your bookkeeper up to now you’re on the same page because, you know, yes, there are going to be some things that challenge the bookkeeper out of their comfort zone and yes, there are some that will not be able to rise to the occasion I apologise in advance any bookkeepers who aren’t good enough. Maybe it’s time if you can’t do what’s in entrepreneurs, maybe it’s time to get into a different career path anyway, and you’ll be happier. So I don’t care like this is about how do we create increased profits in the business so we can either do better for ourselves and there’s nothing wrong with that, or we can have a bigger impact in the world. Those are the two reasons entrepreneurs want to increase profit either for personal reasons, or to have a bigger impact in the world. Either way, get on the same page with the bookkeeper and I you know, honestly It’s not a technical book, there’s stories. There’s examples like I, it’s, yeah, maybe you can probably even tell just by talking to me. I’m not a typical accountant sounding guy. This is not a typical accountant sounding thing. And so it’s a great resource to actually share with the bookkeeper. And, yeah, let me just share kind of one example of something that happened recently, you know, one of our clients does, they do, they do marketing for other brands on Amazon, so they help people, you know, increase their revenue through Amazon sales of whatever products they’re offering. And, you know, when we took over their financials, like, they were 470 lines long in the financial aid, the just the income statement, and I, I’m an account I looked at, I’m like, I can’t follow this. And the way it was set up by that bookkeeper, just, you know, doesn’t make sense. And he literally said to me, I don’t use these because I don’t, they’re just useless. And we did a bunch of restructuring and now we have one report that shows them rank ordered by how much money they make by customer doing their online, you know, support Their online sales, by gross profit by by the by the profit by customer, the best down to the worst. That’s a report, there’s actually a picture showing that so it doesn’t even have to look at the graph at the actual data, they can look at the picture. And now you can go and say, Wow, this is my best customer, this is my next best. And these ones down here are the worst. Okay, well, what are those? What How are those ones similar? And how do we now target those customers at the top of the list and which brands are doing well, and within even which brand? What product categories are selling well, online? So that’s the difference. Like Imagine if you had that level of clarity in your business that you know which products were outperforming from a profitability basis when you’re selling or whatever it is. I mean, that’s game changing. And that’s, you know, like, I mean, and, you know, I think when I talked to glasses, you know, it’s like the skies parted. I finally like I didn’t even look at the information before and now and that’s the power. That’s why you know, yeah, if you Now let’s go to the doctor example again, you know, you’re not going to the doctor for years because you’re not getting the service. I don’t know how your healthcare system over there works. It’s probably fairly similar to over here, but we do have choice and I actually went out and I sought out doctors naturopaths who are kind of a different style of Doctor over here and and actually taking my health in a very proactive way and at 46 years old, I’m healthier than I’ve ever been in my life, because I’ve been proactive about it. No different if you don’t have the right bookkeeper, be proactive about finding the right one who can get your report like I just talked about, because that could be the difference between surviving and failing, or like, not just surviving, but actually thriving and doing amazing and happy and profitable. So for me, I wouldn’t say that was a super windbag long answer to I wouldn’t stick with a bookkeeper and if it’s hard on them too bad.
David Ralph [27:56]
We’re speaking to Spencer Shane in and we will be back with him. After these words,
Unknown Speaker [28:03]
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Unknown Speaker [28:08]
Hello, my name is Alan. And I’ve just completed the excellent eight week course with David.
Unknown Speaker [28:13]
Before I started working with David Actually, I had no idea at all where to start.
Unknown Speaker [28:19]
I had a lot of ideas about while I probably thought was going to be good in business, David was able to help me through that though, to find that passion. Within literally minutes. We had, we had a business idea. And for the last seven weeks, we’ve been building on it and building on it and the position I’m in now, but I think I’ve ever got here on my own because of the amount of information that David gives the structure. He’s got the full package here and he explains it in a way that I can understand. His support is phenomenal. I feel like this is the way business is supposed to work.
Unknown Speaker [28:54]
David helped me understand Okay, what were the next logical steps that I should do? How How can I get up and running. So I would really recommend this as an excellent course helping you if you have an idea if you have no idea, really teasing that out and at some of the practicalities and steps to take to really launch your business, whether as a full time job or a side hustle. So it was really excellent. I recommend it for anybody thinking about setting up their own business. I don’t think it’s an exaggeration to say David will totally save you years. Thank you, David for all your amazing help and support which keeps on going. And we certainly couldn’t be where we are today without you so
Unknown Speaker [29:33]
David Ralph [29:34]
So if you would love to become my next success story and have your own life changing online business following my step by step system, fine tuned over many years to take away the effort and expense that others struggle with. Then come across to Join Up dots.com and book a free call with myself. Let’s get you living the easy life as it’s there waiting for you to get it that is Join Up dots.com business coaching So we’re speaking to Spencer Shane in and he is giving us great advice about choosing the right accountant. And just before we move on to conclude that part of the discussion, I’m interested in entrepreneur numbers again. So what you’re basically saying is, you apply almost like an 8020 principle or parados law to being out but to see where your best customers are, where your most profitable bits are, so that you can focus more energy in your marketing and your your driven customer retention strategies, whatever where the money is, and then spend less time on trying to squeeze the coins out of the bad ones.
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [30:41]
I think that particular analysis is super important for almost any business and whether it’s a parade Oh, by customer by segment by division, by whatever. Pardon me. I really love that analysis. But that was just an example. And it for me, it depends on the business as to what What’s the most important financial insight? You know, a second one, for example might be and it’s a little bit different with online businesses, of course, but you know, one of the silent killers of a lot of businesses, their accounts receivable, and even if you’re online, you may have to give terms to some people, depending on the type of business it is, and, and you know, the type of deal it is, but you give them some payment terms, and all of a sudden, they’re paying you later and later and later, if you don’t have your eyes on collecting that money, you may be profitable, but it’s never hitting your bank account. So it’s just as big an issue. That could be your biggest issue. So for me entrepreneur numbers is about teasing out the biggest financial issues facing the business and rank ordering them in the top three rank ordered by impact on cash or profit. So parado is often up there. The old 8020 rule is often up there like it’s relatively consistent as being one of the key issues, the key findings, but often businesses have been bigger issues. I mean, for businesses that had a lot of labour for example, it might be that their labour costs have gone out of control and doesn’t matter how fast you grow till you fix your labour. So it really depends there’s I offer kind of a, a guideline as to the types of analysis that could be done. Of course, it depends on business and industry. But in general, like there’s, there’s a bit of a path to follow from easy to harder to complex type of analysis, start with the easy ones, and so parados almost always in there. But sometimes there are bigger problems facing a business than having too many small clients depends.
David Ralph [32:36]
So let’s take us back to the conclusion of what we were saying about how to find a good accountant. And if you can’t remember what Spencer said before, you can have to listen to this episode twice. Great, but uh, downwards. So where are we? Because I can’t actually remember where we got up to, but I know you wrote it down.
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [32:54]
Yeah, we had us sort of, or I was explaining kind of what are a few questions you could ask about. bookkeeper to just even get a sense of if they’re on track or not. And I started with ask for a bank rec, what’s the most recent bank Rec and have them show it to you? The second question and this gets a little more accountant sounding. But really you’re asking for the accruals for the last couple months, show me your your accrual schedule. And really what this is, is this is talking about this is both on the revenue side and the expense side. And, you know, an example is you know, you have a customer and you get a nice big fat deposit from them. A lot of bookkeepers will put that into income. Well, the reality is, it’s not income as long as it’s a deposit. And until you actually ship them product or do the work for them. It should stay in on the balance sheet. I don’t want to get technical here, but as a prepay as a prepaid or an accrual, and then when it gets earned, then you quote unquote, earn the money. That’s again where the bank accounts a horrible way to manage the business because you take a big deposit but you haven’t shipped product or you haven’t purchased the raw materials you need in order to ship the product or your, you know, your, your your materials or whether you’re reselling or whatever. So, if they don’t have any accruals, and on the on the expense side, like maybe you have an expense, an annual expense, your insurance, let’s say you happen to have particularly high insurance because of what you’re selling. And maybe you pay that in one instalment over the year. Well, you know, if you pay $12,000, to pick a super easy number of insurance, that expense you actually enjoy, quote, unquote, nobody enjoys insurance, but you enjoy the benefit of the insurance over the 12 months. So it’s actually costing you $1,000 per month, even though you paid it in one shot of $12,000. So again, to understand, am I making money or not making money if in that month, you expense that $12,000 it might look like you had a terrible month, where the next month it looks like you had a great month. Well, that makes it really hard to understand is the business performing well. So that’s what the accruals looks like. So they should have a cruel they should be able to show you. What did they accrue on both the revenue side and the expense side? And if they have none, it probably means you’re doing cash basis accounting. If you’re doing cash basis accounting, you’re gonna have a really, really hard time understanding if you’re making money or not. Yeah, and it just it, it doesn’t match up, but the revenue and the expenses to when they actually incurred that, and there’s a bit of fancy accounting that goes on behind that, but that’s usually the one that captures that really captures it for me in terms of, do you know, like, are you actually even able to get me towards doing this properly? Now, excuse me,
David Ralph [35:44]
let’s spin it on its head and obviously we’ve been talking about how to do the right things and get the right accountant but in your view, what is the sort of the big savings of entrepreneurs What did they do wrong? Is it not keeping the paperwork keeping too much paperwork not being able to get the details. What do they do?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [36:04]
Well, it’s a function of not knowing what they don’t know. And so it’s, it’s the first step of not even getting the hygiene right. So, and that shouldn’t be their job. But their job is to know that they have a bookkeeper that is getting their hygiene, right. And and I should tell you, by the way, if you want to go deeper into that question of is my bookkeeper. Good enough, there is a free download on entrepreneurs calm that you can get, which actually show there’s some additional questions. And then in the book, there’s also the hygiene roadmap and I suspect that’s a free download as well, although on its own, it’s it’s not all that meaningful. You need the information behind it. And it’s basically a set of tick boxes to be like, are we doing this? Are we doing this? Are we doing this? So, because entrepreneurs hate it so much, it tends to be avoided and it tends to be shoved in the back corner of the desk. And so, so a the hygiene isn’t right. And if the hygiene isn’t right, well, guess what? The insights can’t be pulled out. I mean, in your job at, you know, coaching entrepreneurs to improve their business, it’s kind of like if you don’t have that those insights, it’s hard to take the next step. And you need that measurable data in order to determine what’s next. So the failing is really the the not knowing what they don’t know, not knowing what questions to ask not knowing how to take it to the next step. And the because of all that, I hate it. So I don’t, I don’t even do anything with it. It’s the avoidance is the biggest failure. I think, on the entrepreneur side.
David Ralph [37:33]
It’s interesting, I was coaching a guy the other day, and when you do know all this stuff, you kind of forget, as you say that people don’t know it. And he’s been lurching from one business to another. And I sat down and I said, Do you know who your ideal client is? Do you know where they are? Do you know what your price point is? Do you know? And he couldn’t answer any of them? And I said to him, Well, yeah, how did you get into business? And he said, I don’t I think I did. I think business just kind of found me. And I thought that was quite sort of wise really, because there is a on that Simon Sinek speech, start with why he talks about going into companies and saying, What’s your conversion rate and companies are saying 10% and he says, you know, anyone can trip over 10% And so, with that, there’s a lot of people out there, there’s probably millions of people that are saying that they’re in business, but actually, they’re not. They’re just kind of making money. Luckily, I suppose.
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [38:34]
I think that’s so true. And I mean, it’s, you know, I get the benefit of seeing a lot of financial statements. And I’m amazed especially at the beginning when you know, when I’m prospecting or I’m just you know, we’re just analysing somebody to see if they’re a good fit for us because we’re very clear on who are good fit clients are. And I look at I’m like, well, they’re making money but they don’t like they’re making money in spite of themselves. And I think a That luck will run out eventually, like if you’ve tripped over a great product or service. Eventually other competitors will catch up. Or either the luck will run out, or you’ll figure it out. And you’ll actually start to do things really well. And if you’re making money when you’re not on top of it, imagine what can happen. If you shore things up and tighten it up and get really clear and really focused, then you can just go to the moon. That’s the exciting thing for me. It’s not all doom and gloom about what’s not what we don’t understand. It’s about imagine what we can create if we got on top of this stuff, even if there’s a little bit of grunting to get through it.
David Ralph [39:36]
Now, how much grunting did you do Spencer when you started your own business? Because once again, we can all sit in corporate land. I sat in insurance and banks for years and years and years, thinking I was a kind of online genius. But once I got into it, I realised actually I had the hustle and I had the persistence, but I’ve really had to struggle in the early days. What about yourself?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [39:58]
Yeah, my path is a little In that I actually acquired my first business. So after I did my CPA, I was an investment banker. And so I got very accustomed to the mergers and acquisitions. And I ended up partnering with someone. And we acquired the first business, which was actually a manufacturing business and like you, I really resonated when you say this, like I thought, all I have to do is work a little bit harder than everybody else. And I’m like, Oh, it’s really hard. And in fact, it was about five. I’ll just share this. I think you’ll appreciate this about five years in. You know, I’m sitting at my desk, and our receptionist leaned in and we again, we were manufacturing bricks and mortar, we had about 50 or 60 people just to give you kind of a mental context of what we’re talking about. We made skincare products. And just given the time we actually made hand sanitizer so if I was still in hand sanitizer during COVID Yeah, life would be very different for me right now, but I digress. And the receptionist leaned in and said, We’re out of toilet paper. Should I order more and I thought to myself, I am doing Something So, so wrong. If the receptionist has to ask if they can order toilet paper like, what am I going to say? No, no toilet paper. So it is, if you
David Ralph [41:11]
know, it was coming, you could have bought millions of them and then be a billionaire. That would have been earlier.
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [41:18]
Yeah, exactly. So yeah, I mean, I, I found like I had just like you, like I learned. And I mean, I’m still learning how little I know, the more I learned about entrepreneurship, the more I learned, I don’t know. And if it’s not, you know, if it’s not the finance side, and it’s the HR side, if you have staff, if it’s not the HR side, then it’s the strategic side. If it’s not the strategic side, it’s the marketing side, if it’s not the mart, you know, there’s always something more to learn and grow and develop in the business. So for me, entrepreneurship is it’s a much harder journey. Like I even had the conversation not too long ago with someone I met. It’s Oh, you’re an entrepreneur. They Yeah, it’s like all that. Amazing. I’m like, Yeah, I mean, it is amazing. But it’s not like I take vacations whenever I want and I’m, you know, I, I ride off into the sunset, like, I tend to work more than most of the people that work for me, you know, so. And you know, I give up a lot of vacations, and I’ve cancelled a lot of events because something was happening in the business. So it’s a challenging journey. And there’s always always more to learn no question.
David Ralph [42:26]
And I think one of the things Spencer that I’ve certainly learned through the, through the period is you, as I say, you got to know your customer. First of all, you got to know your customer, you got to know what the transformation they’re looking for, what is their pain point to solution, and then limit the amount of choices you give them. And I remember looking at Join Up Dots in the early days and I was doing podcast coaching, I was doing this and I was doing that and SEO courses, and all these kinds of things. And I wasn’t selling any of them. And now I look back I only do two things. I teach people How to create a six figure podcast. And I teach people how to create an online business that drives and that’s the two. And little by little, I’m getting less and less work because I know what my proposition is. clarity in numbers, clarity in business, clarity anywhere is the key. And I think that’s where we struggle with, we feel that we should be doing everything, but actually we should be doing, I suppose parados law, again, we should just be doing what needs to be done to bring in that ideal customer that ideal product. So,
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [43:35]
you know, I totally agree. And just to kind of pay, I was actually thinking as you were speaking like, I don’t have an answer here because you’ve said it was such a great, great comment. You know, I was actually thinking it’s quite interesting as for me, just to give an example, you know, I know our number one BD effort, for example, is speaking, and, you know, we’ve all been other speakers that are salesy, I’m talking about I go out, give a bunch of free, really valuable is Advice. And those few people in the audience that actually need our help will come and find me. I don’t have to shove it in anyone’s face. And I’ve learned that that process really works. And I was actually reading about I was talking a moment ago about still learning and growing. I was reading a book The other day, and really interesting thought about, you know, imagine you only had one customer, or in this case for me, imagine you only had one speaking gig. What is it that you would do differently for that one customer for that one client for that one speaking gig for that one, whatever, that’s different that you’re doing now how you would approach it. And because we’re all going 100 miles an hour, we’re all busy and I stopped and I thought about it. I’m like, Oh, well, if I do like this, this and this, like, I know the right person, on a one on one conversation where I can actually show them financial information, using their own data is the most powerful thing I can do for them. And so I actually realise I can actually offer that up on a very individualised basis to future attendees of my talk. In advance to make the talk even more valuable. And I’m like, if I only had one talk, I would probably get 10 times a result from that. So being super focused, and then, like I would take your comment even one step further to be and then stop and think, imagine now you’re super clear on your one path for growth. Now what? And let’s imagine that you only had one client, like if you had only one coaching client, what is it that you would do differently?
David Ralph [45:30]
Are you asking me the question? Oh, is that a hypothetical one?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [45:34]
Well, it was hypothetical for everyone. But I’d love to I have throw that out to you right now. You would do different.
David Ralph [45:41]
So if you got one customer, what would I do differently? I would,
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [45:45]
how would you approach it?
David Ralph [45:47]
Surely at the moment, I think I would approach it exactly the same as I’m doing. You know, I’ve realised over the the journey that I’m on, I used to, I used to not bring the puzzle Together, I used to teach people Best part and that part. And now over a period of, you know, six or seven years, when somebody gets coaching with me, and this is actually this is a Join Up Dots moment, I used to be in a training environment. I used to stand up doing training courses and development. And I was very good at joining up the dots of a subject, so people would understand it, and I would come out at Yeah, brain wave understanding whatever it was insurance based knowledge or banking, whatever. And I knew the Pro, I knew when the peaks and troughs I knew when lunch had to come, I knew what had to be done after lunch. And now I think I’ve got back again, and it’s taken me a long time to translate that energy flow as opposed to recording it through a course or a session or whatever, so that somebody comes out with the satisfaction of getting their questions answered. I’m not a doctor, but apples firm and they walk out thinking on a soul I’m adopted that when they sit, they come out with the answer that they want. So I would, I’d say that’s where I am at the moment. I couldn’t improve upon what I’m doing. But that’s not to say that two years down the line, I don’t improve.
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [47:15]
Yeah. And and so that I’ll flip the question a little bit is to now imagine five years ago, 10 years ago, 15 years ago, when you were doing things differently before you had the opportunity to refine, refine, refine, imagine if you’d ask that question five years before, would that have potentially led to some of the changes and accelerating the sort of trial and error learning to get there? That was kind of the concept of that idea. Just you know, really getting hyper focused on Am I delivering the best I can for that the experience the product, the service, the whatever, for my customer?
David Ralph [47:52]
Yeah, but doesn’t that throwing back to you? Doesn’t that then put you in a situation as you said, but you don’t know what you don’t know until you find out that You don’t know it, you know, and through the journey of doing this constantly, day in, day out and trying basis doesn’t work in that you can see, but at the time you think you’re doing everything right. You think, you know, why is this not working? And I always read, there was a book that I’ve read called the secrets of a Millionaire Mind by t harv, eker. And this guy was struggling financially and he wasn’t doing well. And then he met this millionaire. And the millionaire said, Don’t worry, I’ll speak to you afterwards. And he thought, brilliant, I get my notepad, I get my pen. And he said, Yeah, he thought he was gonna get the golden goose. He thought he was going to get all the secrets. And the guy said to him, there’s one thing you’re doing wrong. And he went, right. And he’s Penn was poised and he said, You don’t know enough about the process. And that was it. And he sort of walked away with Well, that’s not what I wanted. I wanted it. I think that was really clued up. I look at that. Now. I think that’s where most of us fail. We don’t know enough about it. process.
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [49:01]
Yeah, I totally agree with that, for sure. And so I’ll put a little corollary to my earlier comment about as you’re going through. For me, it’s about being mindful and not just being in a robot mode or, you know, maintenance mode or whatever you want to call it, where you’re just doing the same thing over and over again, without challenging yourself about how to make it better. And when you’re challenging yourself to make it better, continuing to laser focus down to how do I just get the most value for this customer? Because you know what, I mean, what’s one of the best sources of depending what business you’re in new clients is referrals, right? We all know that. And so if people are out there singing your praises, you’re more likely to get the next day anyway. So it’s just about using that experience that you were talking about. And because I went through periods of years where I banged my head against the wall doing the same thing, and it wasn’t until I recognise that I was banging my I didn’t even realise I was banging my head against the wall. I just knew it hurt. So Yeah, it’s just being more it’s for me it was more a common or a mindfulness, around mindfulness around just being focused about how we grow and where we put our energy and not just scrambling, like you said, kind of building off. You were doing all kinds of thing training at the beginning. And now you’re down to two. And being, you know, if you weren’t mindful about that process, if you were still doing 100 things, trying to make them all work and not selling them, but you weren’t intentionally trying to make those switches you could easily still be doing. There’s a lot of people that struggle for 1020 years trying to make a business go. And I think that’s partly because of how busy we all get, and we stopped focusing on what are the few things that are really going to make the difference,
David Ralph [50:42]
which is exactly what Steve Jobs did. And let’s hear from Steve Jobs.
Steve Jobs [50:47]
Of course, it was impossible to connect the dots looking forward when I was in college, but it was very, very clear looking backwards. 10 years later. Again, you can’t connect the dots looking forward, you can only connect them looking backwards. So you have to trust that the dots will somehow connect in your future. You have to trust in something, your gut, destiny, life, karma, whatever. Because believing that the dots will connect down the road will give you the confidence to follow your heart, even when it leads you off the well worn path. And that will make all the difference.
David Ralph [51:22]
Well, we’ve talked about your journey leading up and I think like me and like so many we get to that point where we listen to those words and we go back is spot on. But let’s minute from joining up the dots to building the stepping stones with that, that trust that karma. Where do you see your business and your life going now?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [51:45]
Yes, so I see I actually am very clear on the next couple of steps. I’m currently building shift financial insights. I have some some goals that I have that I would like to do everything every good vision, every good business should have a vision of course I’m clear on mine and that sort of for the next three to five Yours, what I see and actually what I’m hyper passionate about. And you may have a bunch of questions on this, but I’m in early foundation phase of this is I believe I have a way to change how financial information is delivered, analysed, and provided for insights provided to entrepreneurs literally at a global scale, on a crowdsource model. And so part of what shift has been for the last four years and where it’s going for the next few years, is proving that out so that we can actually scale it and really, essentially disrupt how financial information is delivered and interpreted for entrepreneurs at a global scale. So I want to disrupt an industry that’s already going through disruption. The disruption now is about all of the automated accounting systems, you know, Ai, optical readers, all of the things cloud based accounting systems, that part is being disrupted, but I wanted then disrupt the delivery model of accounting in a way that isn’t being seen right now. So that’s kind of phase two. And then phase three. For me, I actually love what you do. I love working with entrepreneurs, I love coaching. I kind of lied a little bit about my why I said it was that I believe entrepreneurs can change the world. And my role is to help them through their financial blind spot. It’s actually my my role. I believe entrepreneurs can change the world. And my role is to help them get beyond where they thought possible for themselves. For the moment, I’m focused on the financial area, because the dots for me joined up to focusing on that. But ultimately, I see leadership development, because I would have been a much better entrepreneur, if I had worked on myself. And I had worked on my leadership skills earlier in my journey, where I was busy thinking it was about business, businesses, so much about our mindset businesses a lot about where we are our health, our balance, our emotional well being sounds very woowoo. But being an entrepreneur is a tough journey and if we’re not in the right place, and when We’re not helping those who surround us, whether they’re employees, whether it’s our family, whether it’s our community, whether it’s our suppliers, if all of that stuff doesn’t align our life gets a lot harder. So developing ourselves as leaders, I mean, you’ve put on a couple of amazing clips already by a couple of great thought leaders, Jim Carrey and Steve Jobs. You know, learning and development to me is is also a neglected part of entrepreneurship, which I am super passionate about. So my longer term goal is to really take the lessons I’ve had owning multiple businesses into how can I help future generations of entrepreneurs do the same. I’m just at this point, still too young and energetic to actually want to do it myself then get into kind of a reflective mode. So I’m still I’m still in the driver’s seat as it as it goes for the moment.
David Ralph [54:49]
And Toma, Glen and Brian and Amanda, my clients I’m working with at the moment. See, that’s the first thing that I say to you. A successful business is as much about mindset The business itself, and it all comes down to that. And if you haven’t got the mindset, then you won’t keep going. You won’t have the persistence you won’t have that that deep Why? I heard Steven Spielberg talking today. And he said, You know, so many people have a dream, but it’s just a pipe dream, you need to have a dream that just won’t let you go, and will wrap its arms around you and becomes part of your life. That’s when things happen. And certainly all of you guys out there, I hope you will have that happen as well. Now this is the last bit of the show and this is a bit of we’ve been leading Spencer, effortlessly up to and this is the record a sermon on the mic when we’re going to send him back in time to have a one on one with his younger self. Yes, the young Spencer is waiting in a room for him to go in and give him some advice and what age would he choose and what advice would you give him? Well, we’re gonna find out because I’m going to play the music. And when it Bates is their time to talk the Sermon on the mic
Unknown Speaker [56:03]
We go with the best of the
Unknown Speaker [56:06]
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [56:21]
So if I’m talking to my mid 20 year old self I got into my first business when I was 26. So if I’m talking to myself at 25 and I’m now 46 so I’ve had 21 years of grinding it out to figure out if I told myself one thing it’s that there is no one thing that I’ve spent so much time always thinking this next client I’ll make it work this next process of the business will make it easy. This next employee will make it easy. There is no one thing that’s gonna make the difference yet having a successful business is a compilation of a tonne of different disciplines finance included, where I have to get all of them to a level of minimum of competence and have the right people helping me take those other things off my plate. There’s no one thing it’s not like what if I do this everything will be great no no no it’s up I do this this this this this this this and I keep doing this this this and even today even having a successful business it’s constantly growing and building and there is no stop there is no end there is no there. It’s you have to keep going have to keep growing, have to keep learning and stop thinking that the one thing is gonna make the difference. It’ll make a small difference, but not the entire difference.
David Ralph [57:46]
Right advice for everybody all the dots joiner, you may not think that they are important at the time, but I tell you what I do connect up. What’s the number one best way our audience can connect with you Spencer?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [57:59]
Yeah, there’s a few ways
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [58:01]
Feel free to shoot me an email if you have a question or burning. Anything burning coming out of today’s interview Spencer at shift financial.co not calm co Of course somebody reserved it and wants to hold me hostage and I refuse to do that. So I have the.co not the.com of course I’m on LinkedIn My last name is s h e i n i n Spencer Shane and you’ll find me there. I’m on I have a web Facebook page Spencer Shane and both my personal one which is not very active, but my business page as well. So all of those entrepreneur numbers calm and yeah, by all means, feel free to reach out. I’m happy to connect. Robbie’s account
David Ralph [58:42]
and I asked for the number one best way you give us about six. Yeah, okay, your numbers right Spencer?
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [58:49]
The best way is Spencer at shift financial co
David Ralph [58:53]
There we go. There we go. clarity. You see, I’ve given it clarity. Spencer, thank you so much for spending time with us today. joining up those dots and please come back again when you got more dots to join up because I do believe that by joining up the dots and connecting our past is always the best way to build our futures Spencer, thank you so much.
Spencer Sheinin from Shift Financial [59:12]
Thanks a tonne David I really enjoyed it
David Ralph [59:16]
Mr. Spencer Shane in So, accountancy it does suck. It really does and it’s one of the things that right at the very beginning I thought I’m outsourcing this I just didn’t want to make a mistake. I didn’t want the the dead taxman to come after me. I always wanted to say Look, that’s why I’ve got an accountant board, just throw it over to him. And it is it is something that is so powerful, but ask the right questions. I went through three, first one was good. second one was no, the first one was rubbish. second one was a bit better. And then this one I’ve got now is really, really good. And I’ll probably be with him until he passes away probably. But hopefully you will be with me until I pass away as well because I’m bringing you a lot more episodes of Join Up Dots. We’ve got many more banging on the door to get their dots shown. And so hopefully you’ll stay with us. Until next time, thank you so much and anybody who wants a clarity session looking at their business and stuff, I’m in lockdown. It’s quite easy to do just come across the Join Up Dots. Connect with me. And we’ll go through your business and we’ll show you exactly why you’re not making the kind of money that you should be looking after yourself. And I’ll see you again by
the end of the conversation. Now it’s time for you to start taking massive action. Create your life, busy only life. We’ll be back again real soon. Join Up Dots, Join Up Dots, Join Up Dots, joy, joy ads.